All Electric NASCAR Series on the Horizon

gone

Team Owner
Joined
Oct 29, 2013
Messages
703
Points
253
Anybody else here with a firefighting background? Electric car fires are absolute nightmares at the moment and I don’t see that changing. It’s all fun and games until we have to dig holes in the infields to put the cars in and flood them


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
The problem with fighting lithium-ion battery fires is that few people know how to do it. Drowning them with water is actually a poor method. The lithium-ion battery industry, as well as the EV industry, needs to do a better job educating firefighters and possibly help distribute the correct kinds of extinguishers.

Lithium-ion batteries contain salts that are self-oxidizing. That means, unlike many other materials, they do not need oxygen from the air to keep them burning - they generate their own oxygen. So smothering them is not sufficient. Lithium-ion batteries burn at a high enough temperature to start and maintain the chemical reaction that causes self-oxidizing. Firefighters must cool these batteries below that temperature. This is why lithium-ion battery fires that appear to be out can reignite even hours later.

In some cases water can actually make the fire worse. Lithium-ion fires can be hot enough to break water down into its components (hydrogen and oxygen) which in turn becomes more fuel for a fire. Generally this does not happen as massive amounts of water are applied (such as from a fire hose) because the water pressure washes away the vapors as they are created. But water that seeps into the battery compartment is vulnerable - particularly when the fire is thought to be out but the batteries are still very hot.

Dry chemical and CO2 extinguishers seem to work the best. The main thing is to get the batteries cooled off quickly and thoroughly. The water used against most fires, typically around ambient temperature, is not cold enough. Smothering blankets can only contain the fire to the battery space - they cannot extinguish the fire, they may only keep it contained to a particular space until the batteries run out of self-oxidizing material.

There are companies working on better methods and materials for extinguishing lithium-ion fires, but they are not publicly well-known yet. I suspect that this technology will improve as EV technology in general improves. Hopefully our fire fighters will get the training and materials they need.

By the way, lithium-ion battery technology is facing competitive battery chemistry technologies that may replace them. Many of these new technologies have less threat of catching fire and can be easier to extinguish.
 

Old 97

Team Owner
Joined
Apr 24, 2016
Messages
1,077
Points
343
Now if we can get Government Motors and the Kamikaze Kids to follow suit it would be great!
 
  • Like
Reactions: sdj

kkfan91

Crab Cakes and Sprint Cars....PA does 1
Joined
Jun 13, 2009
Messages
22,142
Points
1,033
Location
PA
Well further down now.

Story says because talks with Dodge have dried up, though I would think it might have to do with redesigning the whole rear end on the next gen
 

2 Sweet

HMS 4-life
Joined
Apr 21, 2016
Messages
5,708
Points
793
Location
Hilliard, OH

From the article....

"Because it does create that spectacle, it does create that emotional, passionate connection to the vehicle, which helps our brand.

"At this point, with some of the cost and complexity with hybrid, if it’s not going to add to the race, then we don’t think it needs to be on there."

Amen. :salute:
 

Conover

Team Owner
Joined
May 3, 2017
Messages
766
Points
323
Location
Florida
Electric cars without slots, powered by amperage from the track…no on-board batteries. 😁

THAT would be interesting…otherwise leave the dangerous EV NASCAR concepts alone until better tech arrives. Previous discussion regarding fires is a real danger and a massive hazard. Want to endure a 2 hour red flag? Bet it would likely take that long to secure and contain a racing battery fire, even with the best equipment.
 

FLRacingFan

Redundant Tweet enjoyer
Joined
Feb 9, 2013
Messages
33,551
Points
1,033
Location
Florida
Late 2023 was probably ambitious for an electric series but I’d hope they’re still looking at hybrid to add more power and try to attract another OEM within the next few years. I doubt most people could tell a hybrid V8 has been electrified. Garage 56 HMS Camaro is hopefully still a hybrid project.
 

gone

Team Owner
Joined
Oct 29, 2013
Messages
703
Points
253
Although I like electric cars and have built some electric conversions (although I've not raced them) I also am a traditionalist who prefers that NASCAR restricts itself to its original concept: race cars that largely resemble street cars that everybody can purchase. As of today, and probably for several more years, there are only a few electric cars widely available (available everywhere across the country) and I'm not sure that any of them could meet NASCAR's wheelbase and length rules without ridiculous modifications... assuming that NASCAR would allow electrics to compete head-to-head with their gasoline cars. Probably wouldn't happen at all without manufacturer support, and I don't expect that to occur any time soon.

Not sure why people claim that electric car racing is boring? Other than the Formula E races (which I admit I haven't had time to watch) where have they seen electric cars race? Maybe assuming that racing is no good without loud engine noise? If noise is the problem, maybe that's why crowds are down at local tracks too if there isn't a high powered series race that night?

The concerns about battery fires after wrecks is legitimate. Those fires require different firefighting equipment and materials, operated by specially trained people. Getting the right equipment and training should not be much of a problem for an organization like NASCAR, but those fires are harder to deal with. NASCAR would likely need to add rules for battery pack construction that would allow them to be disabled and rendered safe quickly.
 

Charlie Spencer

Road courses and short tracks.
Joined
Oct 17, 2012
Messages
31,339
Points
1,033
Location
Lexington, SC
Although I like electric cars and have built some electric conversions (although I've not raced them) I also am a traditionalist who prefers that NASCAR restricts itself to its original concept: race cars that largely resemble street cars that everybody can purchase. ... and I'm not sure that any of them could meet NASCAR's wheelbase and length rules without ridiculous modifications... assuming that NASCAR would allow electrics to compete head-to-head with their gasoline cars.
They not going to compete against ICE cars. It will be a separate series. Wheelbase and other standards from Cup won't necessarily apply; it will likely be a whole new rulebook, written in chalk like all the others.

NASCAR is (mis)managing multiple series already; it's capable of screwing up one more.
 

Greg

2014 RF YAHOO CHAMP Your leader
Joined
Jun 22, 2011
Messages
19,528
Points
1,033
Waiting for solar hoods, roofs, and trunk lids along with left fenders, doors, quarter panels for some additional sunnage.
 

Hotrod

2022 RFFL Champion
Joined
Feb 8, 2017
Messages
3,406
Points
443
One thing electrically that would intrest me is remote controlled drone/car racing.
Cars about the size of legends doing 280mph while the pilots
controll them from pit road boxes or from a spotters stand. Crashes
that no one gets hurt in.

The dirt race I was at last weekend had a drone flying over the track
during the race for tv coverage. It was amazing seeing how fast they flew
with the green and red blinking lights.
 
Top Bottom