Cup RACE thread ---- Atlanta

jaqua19 said:
I hardly cared for Larson until he won Vegas and I felt some Empathy for the kid due to the situation. I believe in personal growth and second chances which is why I became a supporter of his last year.

However, I certainly was not a fan of him prior to that, and I recall distinctly not liking him very much at CGR. It sucks that some of his fans irritate you, but I was never one of those fans who acted like that, so I don't really care about this Jeff Vs Jimmie rehash. But I'm going to defend the notion that a driver top 5 in points and due for another few wins is in fact, not really in trouble, regardless of how vindicating this season feels.



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Again, nothing personal as you're a passionate fan. We just fall on opposite sides of a fence though we agree on 90+% of things...
 
Dr_B_UNC said:
Again, nothing personal as you're a passionate fan. We just fall on opposite sides of a fence though we agree on 90+% of things...
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My best buddy is a Tony Stewart fan, and I to my core, am a Carl Edwards fan....so I get it lol

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These new cars this year are really amazing:

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Dr_B_UNC said:
Larson is honestly in trouble, no matter how people bend over to defend him for some reason. It doesn’t matter how many sprint races he wins.
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No he isn't. Hendrick always spends the summer testing setups for the playoffs. Dale Jr even talked about it on his podcast recently, that teams are holding their good stuff til the playoffs start because they don't want their gray-area parts being noticed or taken by NASCAR before things really start to count. That 5 is going to be right back to the front this fall.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
Bubba is a 20th place driver who has the raw talent to win, but makes a ton of boneheaded moves.

Any time he does run up front, his pit crew takes him out of it.

He was a non-factor all race today.
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Yeah the driver and his former pit crew both showed they still arent ready.
 
Spotter22 said:
Yeah the driver and his former pit crew both showed they still arent ready.
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Bubba has a chip on his shoulder and he really needs to lose it. He’s in good cars now. He’s been given a new pit crew. Time to calm down, tune out the distractions, and just focus on racing.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
Bubba has a chip on his shoulder and he really needs to lose it. He’s in good cars now. He’s been given a new pit crew. Time to calm down, tune out the distractions, and just focus on racing.
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I think Denny and Bubba are a lot alike in that their biggest problem is between their ears
 
cheesepuffs said:
No he isn't. Hendrick always spends the summer testing setups for the playoffs. Dale Jr even talked about it on his podcast recently, that teams are holding their good stuff til the playoffs start because they don't want their gray-area parts being noticed or taken by NASCAR before things really start to count. That 5 is going to be right back to the front this fall.
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Somebody must have forgot to send that memo to the. 9 team. Honestly, as somebody that wants all four HMS cars to do well, I AM worried about the 5, 24 and 48. Yes they generally show speed, but right now they are getting zip for actual results. Chase scored more playoff points today then I think the other three combined have over the last couple of months, and that DOES matter, especially to the 24 and 48 who are less likely to be able to suddenly get hot and rip off multiple wins in the final 10. The 5 team to me looks like they have the same championship hangover the 9 had last year. Not to be a smartass, but I thought the world’s greatest driver was going to just clean up in the new car.
 
cheesepuffs said:
No he isn't. Hendrick always spends the summer testing setups for the playoffs. Dale Jr even talked about it on his podcast recently, that teams are holding their good stuff til the playoffs start because they don't want their gray-area parts being noticed or taken by NASCAR before things really start to count. That 5 is going to be right back to the front this fall.
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Oh it will. But for now, I'm thrilled.
 
Formerjackman said:
Somebody must have forgot to send that memo to the. 9 team. Honestly, as somebody that wants all four HMS cars to do well, I AM worried about the 5, 24 and 48. Yes they generally show speed, but right now they are getting zip for actual results. Chase scored more playoff points today then I think the other three combined have over the last couple of months, and that DOES matter, especially to the 24 and 48 who are less likely to be able to suddenly get hot and rip off multiple wins in the final 10. The 5 team to me looks like they have the same championship hangover the 9 had last year. Not to be a smartass, but I thought the world’s greatest driver was going to just clean up in the new car.
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They are all four in the top ten in points. I think you need to carry around a fact checker with ya.
 
wi_racefan said:
I think Denny and Bubba are a lot alike in that their biggest problem is between their ears
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Bubba has been pretty open about his struggles with depression.

(First time he won a truck race, fans were shouting the n-word at him from the stands and that was before he went on Don Lemon’s show.)

That’s a lot to deal with. Combined with the team’s struggles.

He’s got to find a way to focus though. In this climate, he’s going to be a lightning rod for attention no matter what. If he can’t handle it, then he’s just not gonna make it.

It’s not fair, but that’s just how it is.

Danica Patrick had a microscope on her too. So does Hailie Deegan, though that microscope has a rose colored lens.

The only way he’s going to get the negative attention off of him is by winning, and even that’s not going to do it, so he’s just gonna have to deal with it.

I root for Bubba, but when his team doesn’t let him down, he lets them down.
 
cheesepuffs said:
No he isn't. Hendrick always spends the summer testing setups for the playoffs. Dale Jr even talked about it on his podcast recently, that teams are holding their good stuff til the playoffs start because they don't want their gray-area parts being noticed or taken by NASCAR before things really start to count. That 5 is going to be right back to the front this fall.
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Taking my bias out, I both agree and disagree.

Winning championships, and dominating seasons includes some luck. The universe is balancing itself. Blowing the motor with the best car in the field at Darlington, and Briscoe causing a caution in the 600 are things that 5 team wouldn't have experienced last year.

That said, in trouble? In trouble in what regard? Are we expecting him to win a championship again this year? Is that the global consensus? I mean, there's only been TWO back to back champions in the last 35 years of cup racing, and they're two of the GOATS of the sport who were superior talents and winners to Larson. So unless we are holding him to that high of a standard, I don't think it's fair to say he's in trouble if he's not looking like he's in form to repeat, as that is something reserved for the GOATs of the sport. But let's say that is the standard to judge him based on last year...

Better yet, let's just judge on an individual season basis: Do they look like a team that can win a championship this year, at this point in the season? Top 5 in points, top 4 driver rating, leads the series in passes vs being passed...despite the hiccups, they may be close. However, as of today, I wouldn't bet on it. There are things they need to clean up. Larson needs to be a bit more patient, the team needs to make better race calling decisions, and the cars are missing just a little something in traffic. So no, they aren't in championship form, and if his entire career is made on him repeating as champion this year, yes, I agree. He's in trouble.

That said, if he finishes the season with something like 3/4 wins, 16 top 5s, 22 top 10s, and a 4th or 5th in points....is that REALLY that bad of a year following up a dominant championship run?


TLDR: Larson isn't catching the lucky breaks they caught last year. Driver and the team as a whole still have some cleaning up to do if they want to repeat as champions, and Larson is in trouble if the expectation is a second championship defines his talents or career. However, if we consider that to be an unfair expectation, a top 5 in points with a few wins, something he is on pace for, and I am expecting, isn't something that should be considered a failure.



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AndyMarquisLive said:
Bubba has a chip on his shoulder and he really needs to lose it. He’s in good cars now. He’s been given a new pit crew. Time to calm down, tune out the distractions, and just focus on racing.
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Yeah he was about to chew his bottom lip off during pre race interviews. He's completely wired and the pressure is drowning him
 
Formerjackman said:
Somebody must have forgot to send that memo to the. 9 team. Honestly, as somebody that wants all four HMS cars to do well, I AM worried about the 5, 24 and 48. Yes they generally show speed, but right now they are getting zip for actual results. Chase scored more playoff points today then I think the other three combined have over the last couple of months, and that DOES matter, especially to the 24 and 48 who are less likely to be able to suddenly get hot and rip off multiple wins in the final 10. The 5 team to me looks like they have the same championship hangover the 9 had last year. Not to be a smartass, but I thought the world’s greatest driver was going to just clean up in the new car.
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I think Larson's pace is being swept under the rug.

I mean really, at Sonoma, that pit strategy threw away what was looking like a win. The Coke 600 would have been a win if not for Briscoe, so just a few minor shifts in luck, or smarts would have had Larson leading the series in wins at 3, weeks ago. And with all those *concerns*, he's still 4th in points, second in top 5s, 4th best average finish, 4th best in driver rating, he also leads the series in pass differential. They just need to clean up. He's way closer to the 9 in both performance and points than he is to the 24/48. He's having a solid season.

Without fixing any mistakes, he's on pace for a 2-3 win season and top 5 points finish, which is a very strong follow up to championship season.

So I disagree. There's concern if you are expecting him to repeat, something only the two GOATS have done in the last 30 years.

Otherwise, he's had a solid strong season, and a stronger season than any of his CGR runs. The speed is there and he's good for probably 2-3 more wins this year.

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Good lord, what a garbage race. Aero pack racing on a 1.5 🫤
I’m glad I didn’t waste an afternoon watching this race.
Chastain is a hack, he needs to understand that not every lap is the last lap.
 
jaqua19 said:
I think Larson's pace is being swept under the rug.

I mean really, at Sonoma, that pit strategy threw away what was looking like a win. The Coke 600 would have been a win if not for Briscoe, so just a few minor shifts in luck, or smarts would have had Larson leading the series in wins at 3, weeks ago. And with all those *concerns*, he's still 4th in points, second in top 5s, 4th best average finish, 4th best in driver rating, he also leads the series in pass differential. They just need to clean up. He's way closer to the 9 in both performance and points than he is to the 24/48. He's having a solid season.

Without fixing any mistakes, he's on pace for a 2-3 win season and top 5 points finish, which is a very strong follow up to championship season.

So I disagree. There's concern if you are expecting him to repeat, something only the two GOATS have done in the last 30 years.

Otherwise, he's had a solid strong season, and a stronger season than any of his CGR runs. The speed is there and he's good for probably 2-3 more wins this year.

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This is actually an interesting conversation, so I’ll join in. :) I didn’t expect Larson to follow up last season with another outstanding, glittering, double-digit win season, personally. He’s had the speed, but him and his team just haven’t been closing out races quite as much. On top of that, parity imposed by the new regulations has played a major hand in everyone’s results. It’s no surprise that the reigning champion *isn’t* an exception to that. I will say that based on results, I think him, his team, Elliott, the 9 team, Chastain, and the 1 team are the ones who have adapted best overall up to this point. In other words, whether he matches that tally or exceeds your/our expectations, he’s really not had anything close to a “bad” season by any metric. I can think of a few other drivers who would probably fit into this conversation more appropriately. MTJ has really surprised me in how much of a quiet year he has had. Denny Hamlin’s performance relative to the impressive consistency we saw out of him last year… I don’t even know if I want to touch on that.
 
StandOnIt said:
They are all four in the top ten in points. I think you need to carry around a fact checker with ya.
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Bowman hasn’t had a top 10 since Charlotte. Byron doesn’t have one since Martinsville. When was the last time the 5 was legitimate threat to win in the second half of the race? Regardless of the reasons, none of these three cars strike me as ones that will go deep into the playoffs at this time, but I suppose my standards snd expectations for HMS are higher than yours.
 
Mispeedway15 said:
I will say watching F1 I’m jealous of their season long points race
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The more you look at how Nascar determines a champion the more you realize its a joke. Imagine in any other sport that you only win 2 games in a regular season but during those 2 games you score 15 runs or 5 touchdowns (or whatever high score for said sport) and because of that you automatically qualify for the playoffs.

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StandOnIt said:
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I don’t got time to read the thread. But let me ask. Did you say anything about Ross and how driving? I remember last time you defended Ross, and admitted if it was Kyle Busch, you would react differently. So yeah, you ain’t got much room to talk.
 
Blaze said:
I don’t got time to read the thread. But let me ask. Did you say anything about Ross and how driving? I remember last time you defended Ross, and admitted if it was Kyle Busch, you would react differently. So yeah, you ain’t got much room to talk.
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If you don't got, you don't got
 
Formerjackman said:
Bowman hasn’t had a top 10 since Charlotte. Byron doesn’t have one since Martinsville. When was the last time the 5 was legitimate threat to win in the second half of the race? Regardless of the reasons, none of these three cars strike me as ones that will go deep into the playoffs at this time, but I suppose my standards snd expectations for HMS are higher than yours.
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7 races before the cutoff. I'm not worried. Until three races ago Elliott had one win
 
I was moving today so I could only pop in here and there on my phone and didn't have the volume up, but was the Chase stuff really that bad? I mean he did start on the pole in his home town as the sport's most popular driver, dominated the race and won everything there was to win today and made a killer move to do it at the end. That's pretty compelling television if you take a step back and look at it from an honest point of view. There's a lot of story line there. And by the way, every league has players that they do this for, it's not exclusive to NASCAR.
 
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