Cup RACE thread --- Sonoma

Need a couple more high-speed ovals back, honestly. They shed the calendar of them and now they’re the best product again like peak Gen 4.

When it came to the schedule, NASCAR went all in on listening to online fans. They brought back Wilkesboro, added short tracks, and added road courses. I've never seen a sports sanctioning body cater to loud online fans the way that NASCAR did when they were putting together the schedule.
 
I think Stenhouse is a decent midpack driver. Certainly a better fit for RCR than is Kyle Busch.
Ricky has his moments but, IMO, is just a mediocre driver at the Cup level. I don’t think he’d get a championship in a JGR or HMS car.
 
I think Stenhouse is a decent midpack driver. Certainly a better fit for RCR than is Kyle Busch.
Ricky has his moments but, IMO, is just a mediocre driver at the Cup level. I don’t think he’d get a championship in a JGR or HMS car.
That's fine the field should always have a mix of legends and just fast guys.
 
I think Stenhouse is a decent midpack driver. Certainly a better fit for RCR than is Kyle Busch.
Ricky has his moments but, IMO, is just a mediocre driver at the Cup level. I don’t think he’d get a championship in a JGR or HMS car.

Eh, not every driver is going to be a Chase Elliot, a Kyle Larson or a Kyle Busch. Sometimes it's nice to see a driver make incrimental improvements week in and week out. Stenhouse may not set the NASCAR world on fire, but his improvements are worth a small celebration.
 
Eh, not every driver is going to be a Chase Elliot, a Kyle Larson or a Kyle Busch. Sometimes it's nice to see a driver make incrimental improvements week in and week out. Stenhouse may not set the NASCAR world on fire, but his improvements are worth a small celebration.
I agree. Chase Elliott wouldn’t be a Chase Elliott if his dad wasn’t Bill Elliott.
 
He ain’t no Kyle Larson.
Larson got there without he daddy’s name.
Okay and I didn’t mention him did I. You said he not have a championship without his name. I said or his talent. Name can’t get you everything. Kyle Petty, Dale Jr, and Corey LaJoie just to name a few who had/have a last name but didn’t win a Cup Series Championship. Chase has talent, deal with it.
 
Okay and I didn’t mention him did I. You said he not have a championship without his name. I said or his talent. Name can’t get you everything. Kyle Petty, Dale Jr, and Corey LaJoie just to name a few who had/have a last name but didn’t win a Cup Series Championship. Chase has talent, deal with it.
Well I don’t have a problem dealing with reality. Chase wouldn’t be in the 9 if his dad wasn’t Bill.
Chase won’t ever be as talented in a racecar as Kyle Larson.
This is reality.
Cory LaJoie isn’t a prodigy and won’t ever compete for a legitimate Cup win.
Dale Jr. was never a weekend threat for a win. Probably wouldn’t have been in a decent car, either, without the last name.
Kyle Petty is another example of a decent ride based on name instead of talent.
Some guys prove their worth by how they handle a racecar, not by their daddy’s name. That was my point.
Kyle and Kurt Busch are good examples. I think Stenhouse is a good driver, without the nepotism, he doesn’t get the same shot that Elliott gets. Elliott got beat today by guys that didn’t have championship dads.
I’m dealing with it.
 
Well I don’t have a problem dealing with reality. Chase wouldn’t be in the 9 if his dad wasn’t Bill.
Chase won’t ever be as talented in a racecar as Kyle Larson.
This is reality.
Cory LaJoie isn’t a prodigy and won’t ever compete for a legitimate Cup win.
Dale Jr. was never a weekend threat for a win. Probably wouldn’t have been in a decent car, either, without the last name.
Kyle Petty is another example of a decent ride based on name instead of talent.
Some guys prove their worth by how they handle a racecar, not by their daddy’s name. That was my point.
Kyle and Kurt Busch are good examples. I think Stenhouse is a good driver, without the nepotism, he doesn’t get the same shot that Elliott gets. Elliott got beat today by guys that didn’t have championship dads.
I’m dealing with it.
And Ty Gibbs got by on his name. Doesn’t take away the talent he has. Same with Chase.
 
Well I don’t have a problem dealing with reality.

You think Kyle Busch is driving **** tier equipment right now and that Ross Chastain is having a bad year despite being 5th in points. The evidence isn't in your favor on this one.

Dale Jr. was never a weekend threat for a win. Probably wouldn’t have been in a decent car, either, without the last name.

This is also a good example. Dale Jr. won two NASCAR Busch Series Championships back when the field was pretty damn competitive. He won 2 races during his rookie year in Cup (and The Winston). He was a pretty consistent threat to win when DEI was hot.
 
And Ty Gibbs got by on his name. Doesn’t take away the talent he has. Same with Chase.
I disagree. Ty wouldn’t have the same shot either if it weren’t for his name.
I look at Larson as a sort of Stewart type driver. I think Larson could win in anything if he didn’t overdrive the schit and beat himself.
I don’t see that raw talent out of Elliott. Or Ty.
Put Elliott or Ty in the old CGR car; do they get a win? My guess is no.
 
I disagree. Ty wouldn’t have the same shot either if it weren’t for his name.
I look at Larson as a sort of Stewart type driver. I think Larson could win in anything if he didn’t overdrive the schit and beat himself.
I don’t see that raw talent out of Elliott. Or Ty.
Put Elliott or Ty in the old CGR car; do they get a win? My guess is no.
Then we just got to agree to disagree. Equipment helps, but you need the talent to win also. Did their names help? Yeah sure. But they also have the talent to back it up.
 
He ain’t no Kyle Larson.
Larson got there without his daddy’s name.
How many guys "ain't no Kyle Larson" and still have titles and are still considered great? Why does this only apply to Chase Elliott?

Corey Lajoie and Josh Berry both didn't do jack speed-wise in Elliott's car, so obviously it's a little more than this last name that's getting it done.
 
How many guys "ain't no Kyle Larson" and still have titles and are still considered great? Why does this only apply to Chase Elliott?

Corey Lajoie and Josh Berry both didn't do jack speed-wise in Elliott's car, so obviously it's a little more than this last name that's getting it done.
I was trying to stay consistent with the current dialogue of the thread.
Explain why Chase deserves an HMS ride. Please show career race stats that compare with a no-name like Kyle Larson.
 
How many guys "ain't no Kyle Larson" and still have titles and are still considered great? Why does this only apply to Chase Elliott?

Corey Lajoie and Josh Berry both didn't do jack speed-wise in Elliott's car, so obviously it's a little more than this last name that's getting it done.
It's mostly a whole bunch of nonsense. In Larson's case, his mom and dad from the time he could walk taught him about racing, his mom held him on his lap when he was a child at races and explained what was going on. It's pretty much complete B.S.. It doesn't matter who it is, they start their racing careers at a young age. Just let it go.
 
I was trying to stay consistent with the current dialogue of the thread.
Explain why Chase deserves an HMS ride. Please show career race stats that compare with a no-name like Kyle Larson.
At age 13, Elliott was featured alongside thirteen other athletes, including future world number one golfer Jordan Spieth and future NBA 2nd overall pick Michael Kidd-Gilchrist, as potential stars in the July 13, 2009 issue of Sports Illustrated.[2] Elliott raced in 40 races in various series in 2010, winning twelve events over the course of the year and finishing in the top ten 38 times.[3] It was the third season of his racing career, and he won the Blizzard Series, Miller Lite and Gulf Coast championship en route to being named the Georgia Asphalt Pro Late Model Series Rookie of the Year.[3] He ended the season by winning the Winchester 400.[3] Sports Illustrated named Elliott as the high school player of the week in April 2011.[3] During the year, he competed in the Champion Racing Association, winning the series' National Super Late Model championship.[4] Later that year, just after his sixteenth birthday, he won the Snowball Derby and became the race's youngest winner.[5] He beat the second place driver, D.J. Vanderley, by a record 0.229 seconds.[6] In 2012, he won the Alan Turner Snowflake 100, prelude to the Snowball Derby, for the second time in three years.[7]
 
In Gen 6, everyone ran the same brake packages. Chase Elliott had a feel / skill advantage.

Gen 7‘s larger brakes are common to all the teams. What’s the reason for his decline?
He doesn’t have that HMS braking edge. The box is smaller now, so the gap between the haves and have nots is less. I do believe HMS had a road course advantage figured out. Heck, maybe Freddie Kraft and Rev were eighth screeching about the Track Attack program. Whatever it was, NASCAR neutered it in the next Gen car. And people said adding more roadies was to get the Golden Child more wins…. They actually neutered him.
 
When it came to the schedule, NASCAR went all in on listening to online fans. They brought back Wilkesboro, added short tracks, and added road courses. I've never seen a sports sanctioning body cater to loud online fans the way that NASCAR did when they were putting together the schedule.
Too bad they won’t listen to us about this POS car.
 
Too bad they won’t listen to us about this POS car.
There isn't anything wrong with the car. 10 different winners so far, last year more than that. Super highly competitive racing. Try F-1, it's much easier to pick a dominate driver there. Not easy to bandwagon in Nascar. Got to take the bitter with the sweet. In Elliott's case he put himself behind the 8 ball, but all of that can miraculously change with a race win but those don't come easily with the competition that is out there.
 
There isn't anything wrong with the car. 10 different winners so far, last year more than that. Super highly competitive racing. Try F-1, it's much easier to pick a dominate driver there. Not easy to bandwagon in Nascar. Got to take the bitter with the sweet. In Elliott's case he put himself behind the 8 ball, but all of that can miraculously change with a race win but those don't come easily with the competition that is out there.
In your opinion
 
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He doesn’t have that HMS braking edge. The box is smaller now, so the gap between the haves and have nots is less. I do believe HMS had a road course advantage figured out. Heck, maybe Freddie Kraft and Rev were eighth screeching about the Track Attack program. Whatever it was, NASCAR neutered it in the next Gen car. And people said adding more roadies was to get the Golden Child more wins…. They actually neutered him.
In other words, driving for the best, most successful team in the history of the sport was / is advantageous. 😎
 
In other words, driving for the best, most successful team in the history of the sport was / is advantageous. 😎
It's a tough pill to swallow for some that the larger owners in the sport saw to it and took it upon themselves to take up the steps to even up the competition between the teams. Without any rules, two or three owners would each have ten or twelve cars, spend gidzillions to keep it that way and that would be it.
 
Same opinion here.

Best race car in the history of the sport. By miles.

My  only issue with the NextGen car is that it sucks out loud on short tracks and IMHO, that's where stock cars usually put on the best show. Of course, I'm not an engineer so I don't know what the solution is. I'm sure NASCAR is working on it.
 
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