Deegan update

I don’t see any reason to even think about canceling or moving this thread to the basement. If it is to much for anyone then don’t click on.
 
I keep getting reports on this thread asking it to be taken down.
My question --- If you don't like this thread, why do you persist in opening it and posting in it?
Makes no sense to me. But then, most of the thread makes no sense to me.
I just ignore it since I'm not interested in it.

Off to work I go. Oh, joy.
 
nascarwoman said:
I keep getting reports on this thread asking it to be taken down.
My question --- If you don't like this thread, why do you persist in opening it and posting in it?
Makes no sense to me. But then, most of the thread makes no sense to me.
I just ignore it since I'm not interested in it.

Off to work I go. Oh, joy.
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That's a good question. What she said.
 
nascarwoman said:
I keep getting reports on this thread asking it to be taken down.
My question --- If you don't like this thread, why do you persist in opening it and posting in it?
Makes no sense to me. But then, most of the thread makes no sense to me.
I just ignore it since I'm not interested in it.

Off to work I go. Oh, joy.
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Reported?

There's nothing wrong with the discourse in this thread lol

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
 
jaqua19 said:
Reported?

There's nothing wrong with the discourse in this thread lol

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
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Eh, you can scroll back, one or two of em came up with that lol. They got to be mad all the time at something, somehow, somewhere lol.
 
StandOnIt said:
Eh, you can scroll back, one or two of em came up with that lol. They got to be mad all the time at something, somehow, somewhere lol.
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Yeah tbh I don't read entire threads. I basically just scroll from my recent comments lol

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
 
jaqua19 said:
She needed to be a brand and a product in itself.

It's ******. But that's just how NASCAR is.
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I don't understand why you feel one approach is bull**** compared to another approach to getting into NASCAR. ?
 
zevious said:
I don't understand why you feel one approach is bull**** compared to another approach to getting into NASCAR. ?
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We all know the business model is broken. Several people on here have criticized this very business model. But, suddenly, when it comes to Hailie Deegan, those same poster's attitude is that the business model is fine, we should all learn to love it, and she's not going anywhere.

They'll complain about "rich kids" in other threads, call out other drivers for having more money than talent, complain about how they got their ride because of their rich daddy or last name or whatever. But, when it comes to Hailie Deegan, it's all fine and you're a misogynist if your beliefs about the business model are consistent.
 
Some people spend hundreds of thousands of dollars per year to send their kids to Harvard.

Bad business model?
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
We all know the business model is broken. Several people on here have criticized this very business model. But, suddenly, when it comes to Hailie Deegan, those same poster's attitude is that the business model is fine, we should all learn to love it, and she's not going anywhere.

They'll complain about "rich kids" in other threads, call out other drivers for having more money than talent, complain about how they got their ride because of their rich daddy or last name or whatever. But, when it comes to Hailie Deegan, it's all fine and you're a misogynist if your beliefs about the business model are consistent.
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Have you had your coffee yet?
 
aunty dive said:
Some people spend hundreds of thousands of dollars per year to send their kids to Harvard.

Bad business model?
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Affirmative action got stuck down because the college admissions process is supposed to be a meritocracy, but legacy admissions remain, and it may now be harder than ever for lower-income Americans to achieve the advantage of a higher education.

Many of the same people who argued that affirmative action should be struck down are defending the existence of legacy admissions.

We have the same thing here.

I don't blame a parent for spending money for their kid's education, or racing career. If I had that kind of money and my kid wanted to go racing, you damn well bet I'm paying for him/her to have the best equipment, the best crew chief, the best driver coach, and so on. This has priced the lower and lower-middle class, which was the backbone of stock car racing, out of the sport.

I blame the sport as a whole for allowing it to get to that point. (I can elaborate a ton more on this.)

But here we have fans, and numerous other drivers, who have been outspoken about how that's the problem and how NASCAR needs to be a meritocracy and how "rich kids" are killing the sport. Then, when the subject is Hailie Deegan, their entire mindset, their beliefs on this subject, take a radical 180-degree shift. And if you dare to criticize anything about it, you're a misogynist.

Even though some of us are literally rooting for Hailie Deegan to take that next step.
 
aunty dive said:
Some people spend hundreds of thousands of dollars per year to send their kids to Harvard.

Bad business model?
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Yep, it costs money to race, parents and young drivers learn that in Kart racing 101. Bleeding hearts with numerous axes to grind can find a fertile field in Motorsports. Heard it all a hundred times. Find another hobby..Racing is expensive.
 
The Nature Boy said:
Harvard is also free for families who make under $120,000. There’s no such aid for lower income race car drivers.
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There are things that can be done to drive costs down significantly. There are two racetracks in the Southeast that are doing just that and having results pushing affordable, local programs.

NASCAR is doing just that with the NextGen car. But the people who have the money will ALWAYS stand in the way of progress and actively work to drive costs up. Roush did it in the late-2000s when NASCAR took steps to reduce costs. Hendrick's done it as well.

No different than how the wealthy are trying to drive wages back down to $7.25/hour and drive the cost of living so sky-high that Americans are forced to work 100 hours a week. The ultra-wealthy are on tape saying these are their goals, and the majority of us (meaning not you and me) passively accept it.
 
nascarwoman said:
I keep getting reports on this thread asking it to be taken down.
My question --- If you don't like this thread, why do you persist in opening it and posting in it?
Makes no sense to me. But then, most of the thread makes no sense to me.
I just ignore it since I'm not interested in it.

Off to work I go. Oh, joy.
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You can’t take this down… 52 pages!!!

In all seriousness, it’s not that serious. I’ve never used the report button on here and I’ve never seen anything that would make me even think to. Twitter and Reddit make this place seem like Heaven.
 
StandOnIt said:
Find another hobby..Racing is expensive.
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Are you actually a fan of racing?

That's a sincere question. I watch racing to watch the best drivers in the world compete with each other. I don't like this tacit acceptance of auto racing being a place where nepo babies compete amongst themselves. As @AndyMarquisLive pointed out, NASCAR and others are taking steps to reduce costs. Tacitly accepting that auto racing is only for the rich is damaging to the sport.

Anyone who is a fan of racing should want to see the best drivers make it.
 
The Nature Boy said:
Harvard is also free for families who make under $120,000. There’s no such aid for lower income race car drivers.
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That doesn’t alter the fact that some wealthy families spend a lot of money to ensure their children are advantaged by degrees from prestigious educational institutions.

Some people bring their kids up through the auto racing ranks with second hand cars and open trailers paid for with mortgages on the family home. Some pay Keith Kunz Motorsports $20,000 a week to arrive and drive.

Six of one …
 
The Nature Boy said:
Are you actually a fan of racing?

That's a sincere question. I watch racing to watch the best drivers in the world compete with each other. I don't like this tacit acceptance of auto racing being a place where nepo babies compete amongst themselves. As @AndyMarquisLive pointed out, NASCAR and others are taking steps to reduce costs. Tacitly accepting that auto racing is only for the rich is damaging to the sport.

Anyone who is a fan of racing should want to see the best drivers make it.
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NASCAR’s cost reduction initiatives have been successful in making the cars of multi-millionaires competitive with those owned by billionaires.
 
The Nature Boy said:
Are you actually a fan of racing?

That's a sincere question. I watch racing to watch the best drivers in the world compete with each other. I don't like this tacit acceptance of auto racing being a place where nepo babies compete amongst themselves. As @AndyMarquisLive pointed out, NASCAR and others are taking steps to reduce costs. Tacitly accepting that auto racing is only for the rich is damaging to the sport.

Anyone who is a fan of racing should want to see the best drivers make it.
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That's your opinion. I think it is head in the clouds B.S. myself. Racing has always been rich man's/women's sport. You two with the axe to grind go ahead and "fix" it.
Somebody wasn't paying attention. Some of the louder mouths in the sport were wanting more money. I assumed it has been solved, I haven't read anything to the contrary.
 
aunty dive said:
NASCAR’s cost reduction initiatives have been successful in making the cars of multi-millionaires competitive with those owned by billionaires.
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And, as a result, guys like Ross Chastain, Josh Berry and Corey Lajoie are getting to compete in Cup, in competitive rides, on merit. Ten years ago, Josh and Corey would've been told to pound sand while Brandon Jones and Riley Herbst would get those rides.

Because of NASCAR's cost-cutting measures, people who got rides because of money and last names alone are having to prove it on the track. Just like fans wanted 5-10 years ago. And guys who aren't good enough aren't getting Cup rides.

But now, y'all want to go back to the days where talented drivers don't get a chance to prove it anymore.
 
StandOnIt said:
If ya can't find anybody to argue with, ya just make $hit up. :XXROFL:
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Kyle Larson comes to the table with absolutely no backing (because Corporate America thinks he's more radioactive than Fukushima) in 2012, he doesn't get an opportunity.

M&Ms drops Kyle Busch in 2014 and nobody else steps up to sponsor him, and he's gone. Richard Childress goes with Austin Dillon instead because, if he's going to fund it out of pocket, it'll be for his grandson.

If that model existed today, JGR would consist of Baby Rev, Riley Herbst, Brandon Jones and Denny Hamlin - and all of them would be winning Cup races because of the equipment disparity.

(Let's not forget how close Kyle Busch came to losing his ride altogether when he hooked Ron Hornaday at Texas.)

John Wes Townley was getting opportunities in 2012 that he'd have zero chance of getting in today's landscape.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
If the model SOI and Aunty want existed, the runaway greatest most talented driver in all of oval racing (Kyle Larson) wouldn't have a ride.
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What “model” have I advocated for?

AndyMarquisLive said:
But now, y'all want to go back to the days where talented drivers don't get a chance to prove it anymore.
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You’re a sick little puppy.
 
aunty dive said:
My “stand“ on the young lady’s Truck Series performance record is pretty well documented. You can look it up if you like.
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I don't even know where he stands on her development. Which is the entire point of the past three pages. He argues with people who agree with him that Deegan would be better off in Xfinity. He has said the Truck Series is a joke and people wreck her on purpose because they're sexist and can't stand she's outrunning them, then turns around and pretends the Truck Series is the epitome of talent scouting and says the CARS Tour is a joke. (Solely because he hates me with every fiber of his being and knows I'm an advocate of the tour.)

I know where you stand on Deegan, which is why I'm confused about your positions about money and racing. NASCAR is taking steps, for the positive, to cut costs. The sport is more of a meritocracy now than it's been in a generation, and the racing is improving as a result. It's possible to cut costs, it's possible on the lower levels. Racing is expensive, but it doesn't have to be.

If NASCAR just "Accepted" that it's "A rich man's game," numerous hacks would be in Cup and talented drivers would be fighting for rides in Xfinity or Trucks.

There are steps that can be taken, top to bottom, to make racing thrive. But too many people don't care to do so and would rather take a defeatist attitude. Many more would rather be "right" about what's "killing the sport" than actually step up and contribute.

Despite our problems in racing, from NASCAR on down, the trajectory is positive. And we should do everything we can to keep momentum going.

As for Deegan, most of us want her to succeed and are offering valid, constructive commentary about her career, but one troll just wants to call everyone misogynist and argue about page count or something. One troll wants to pretend that 52 pages on an internet forum that the industry thinks is "a joke" and "a black hole of logic" is why she deserves top-tier rides and is some household name despite the fact that she's running out of money.
 
acmerocket said:
i do like to see that her crew chief and driving couch, take the time to go with her to the superstar races.
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Yeah her Chief comes but doesn't have to, he wants to. She got caught up a couple times in Tracy's messes, and this time without him being in the field Hailie had a good result.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
@The Nature Boy and myself are both agreeing with assertions you've made in the past that Hailie Deegan would do better in Xfinity, or another series, where she could learn without getting caught up in accidents every week. We're agreeing with your past beliefs that the Truck Series is a demolition derby that's holding her back.

You're literally arguing just to argue at this point.

The fact that Kyle Larson and Ross Chastain, who have won multiple Truck Series races in the past couple years with ease, struggled in their CARS Tour appearances tells me everything I need to know about the caliber of competition and which series is better for driver development.
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I dont know how much info you can glean from Chastain and Larson winning in the trucks but struggling in a Cars Tour race. Its not possible to judge Larson in those cars for one race. I dont know how many Chastain ran in so not sure of his record. What they are running now in Late Model set ups take some getting used to even for a seasoned driver like Larson and Ross, we know they can drive its more getting used to the feel of a car that as soon as it hits the track collapses down on to bumpstops and beats your brains out. It took a ton of practice time for Jr to get used to, Kevin Harvick even struggled. The guys who have been running it every weekend have a tremendous advantage.
 
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