Denny Hamlin Appreciation Thread

jaqua19 said:
So what's the problem and how tf is anyone wrong?
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This place isn't as bad as other places, but if you had gone to Reddit or similar places, there were people saying "this car is going to kill someone" or something similarly as hyperbolic.

There was also blatant misrepresentation of concussion data and fans pretending that this is the first car to give drivers concussions when Dale Jr. famously retired due to multiple concussions and drivers have said that they raced concussed. NASCAR's enhanced screening protocols were used to exaggerate the extent of the concussion problem.

People are wrong when they exaggerate and misrepresent data. I HATE hysteria.
 
The Nature Boy said:
This place isn't as bad as other places, but if you had gone to Reddit or similar places, there were people saying "this car is going to kill someone" or something similarly as hyperbolic.

There was also blatant misrepresentation of concussion data and fans pretending that this is the first car to give drivers concussions when Dale Jr. famously retired due to multiple concussions and drivers have said that they raced concussed. NASCAR's enhanced screening protocols were used to exaggerate the extent of the concussion problem.

People are wrong when they exaggerate and misrepresent data. I HATE hysteria.
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This place is great. The way I see it is this. Fans are invested in this sport, and they are invested in their drivers. We've seen injuries pop up last year in ways we have seen in a while. Life threatening? No. But does it matter? There are a lot of fans who spend a lot of time watching their drivers wreck, and walk away. A new car and injuries absolutely brings a reasonable amount of anxiety into fans - especially newer fans these last 20 years. Sure. Hysteria and "death!" Is an extreme, and if that's what we are referring to, then I get it.


But no one wants to see drivers get hurt..and we were seeing drivers get hurt far more frequently than we've been accustomed to these last 20 years. For some people, that's terrifying, and people have every right to express that how they may. I can't speak to hysteria, but catastrophic thinking isn't that, and I think you may be generalizing.

I too was anxious and worried about driver injury. I'm glad that NASCAR has made improvements and drivers and fans watching can feel more safe about the sport ..and NASCAR deserves credit for tirelessly resolving these issues...but I hate to see such passionate fans' concerns invalidated, and "hysteria" isn't a fair label for the majority concerns of those who were genuinely uncomfortable with what happened last year. I agree hysteria, if there is any, is a bit much, but I still feel there was a lot of justified worry, stress and concern amongst some fans..just because you didn't worry doesn't mean worry isn't valid.

Cut the worried folks some slack :)


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aunty dive said:
The Gen 6 chassis / cage structure was shown to be deficient in several areas and was revised on numerous occasions after its debut, up to and including its final season in the Cup series, in order to make it safer.
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It was, but it continued development on a basically ancient design, and it was generally fixing areas that had really not been considered before. The new car was a clean sheet design conceived in an era where computers and simulation can eliminate 95% of the guesswork, and they had an existing standard to gauge against. It's not very damn hard to back a Gen 6 car into a safer barrier at say 100 MPH and do the exact same thing with a Gen 7 and compare data, but if this EVER happened at all, they clearly ignored the data. There is absolutely ZERO excuse for building a NEW car that produces higher impact numbers to a driver's body from a run of the mill rear wall impact with no extenuating circumstances, then the 50 year old design it is supposed to replace. Like I said, the OEM's and the Government do testing like this EVERY DAY, it's no great mystery.
 
Revman said:
Denny actually said, "I'm glad that I don't drive for him then." Which I agree, and then went on to point out that fans like to identify with their drivers, and basically how that's difficult in the Chain Gang because there is always a white collar behind them....which is probably good for a guy like Larson who has demonstrated the ability to almost **** his career over a video game. Maybe Jeffy doesn't trust his drivers? BTW....How has Denny distracted anybody? WE represent 50% of the remaining drivers with a shot. Distract me more. You do understand what is going on here, don't you? Jeffy is playing mind games again. Just like he did with the louvers....attacking anybody that would call into question The Chain Gang's integrity when he knew they had cheated. Then, we have the Felon himself who took up residence in Chastain's head...and where is he now? This is the stupid **** they do when they are worried about their speed. Chadly can't be far behind trying to capture some of the attention crumbs.
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I'm glad Denny doesn't drive for HMS too. Just like I was thrilled when they showed KB the door. The fact is there are different corporate cultures and not everybody fits into every one. Doesn't make anybody right or anybody wrong. HMS has one way of going about things, JGR and 23XI SEEM to have a different way. Like I said before, one KEY difference is that Denny is a car owner, and when he speaks on many of the issues, he's doing it AS AN OWNER, and the world generally only comes to only HIM to talk about it. If Chase or Kyle or William or Alex goes out and says something extremely provocative, it will likely be Jeff and Rick dealing with it as much as the person who said it, and they choose not to. The situations are not really the same. I have NO PROBLEM with Denny speaking his mind, in fact I'm for it, but you also have to know your place. In my professional situation, I am the second longest tenured active employee in the company. That gives me far more leeway to go off the reservation than most of my far less senior co-workers. Denny's "place" is far different than the current four HMS drivers.
 
Revman said:
Denny actually said, "I'm glad that I don't drive for him then." Which I agree, and then went on to point out that fans like to identify with their drivers, and basically how that's difficult in the Chain Gang because there is always a white collar behind them....which is probably good for a guy like Larson who has demonstrated the ability to almost **** his career over a video game. Maybe Jeffy doesn't trust his drivers? BTW....How has Denny distracted anybody? WE represent 50% of the remaining drivers with a shot. Distract me more. You do understand what is going on here, don't you? Jeffy is playing mind games again. Just like he did with the louvers....attacking anybody that would call into question The Chain Gang's integrity when he knew they had cheated. Then, we have the Felon himself who took up residence in Chastain's head...and where is he now? This is the stupid **** they do when they are worried about their speed. Chadly can't be far behind trying to capture some of the attention crumbs.
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Rev, IIRC, you were the loudest supporter of Larson's willingness to grow from his mistake back in 2021 and seemed pretty appreciative of his efforts to become a better person.

Now it seems like your using that as a character flaw?

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jaqua19 said:
Rev, IIRC, you were the loudest supporter of Larson's willingness to grow from his mistake back in 2021 and seemed pretty appreciative of his efforts to become a better person.

Now it seems like your using that as a character flaw?

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Larson was unsigned at the time so there was a slight chance he could come back in a Toyota. He wasn't a POS until he signed with Hendrick.
 
Daytripper said:
Larson was unsigned at the time so there was a slight chance he could come back in a Toyota. He wasn't a POS until he signed with Hendrick.
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No, he was echoing this sentiment throughout the 2021 season.

I genuinely believe Rev can't stand HMS, but if I'm honest, I think he plays a bit as well. He reminds me of a movie supervillain who just waltzes into the superhero's base wearing some impervious suit of armor, monologuing about how they're foolishly not the heroes the world needs, and laughing with his arms raised, and head ****ed back as the heroes attacks do nothing, and then comes Captain America to verbally challenge all of that.

And that's the saga of Rev vs SOI. They're awesome lol

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Formerjackman said:
As long as he is associated with "23 tennis shoe" I think most sponsors will take his comments with a grain of salt. Tony Stewart was a complete ass as often as he wasn't, and he has never seemed to hurt for sponsors and business partners. I would agree with you on this in MOST cases, but some people are truly playing by a different set of rules than others are.
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Tony used to throw things at people and hit them lol!
 
Revman said:
Inclusive of the indictment?
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Rick was indicted for purchasing an extra allocation of Honda vehicles. It's standard practice as the factory reps normally hold an unofficial auction for the extra vehicles. Should that bother you or me? Should we be concerned about Gene Haas' attempting to cheat the American taxpayer? If not, why not?
 
The Nature Boy said:
This place isn't as bad as other places, but if you had gone to Reddit or similar places, there were people saying "this car is going to kill someone" or something similarly as hyperbolic.

There was also blatant misrepresentation of concussion data and fans pretending that this is the first car to give drivers concussions when Dale Jr. famously retired due to multiple concussions and drivers have said that they raced concussed. NASCAR's enhanced screening protocols were used to exaggerate the extent of the concussion problem.

People are wrong when they exaggerate and misrepresent data. I HATE hysteria.
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There were also people who were legitimately upset that Nascar had not done a better job of constructing the current car. I think those concerns and complaints were fair.
 
Formerjackman said:
I'm glad Denny doesn't drive for HMS too. Just like I was thrilled when they showed KB the door. The fact is there are different corporate cultures and not everybody fits into every one. Doesn't make anybody right or anybody wrong. HMS has one way of going about things, JGR and 23XI SEEM to have a different way. Like I said before, one KEY difference is that Denny is a car owner, and when he speaks on many of the issues, he's doing it AS AN OWNER, and the world generally only comes to only HIM to talk about it. If Chase or Kyle or William or Alex goes out and says something extremely provocative, it will likely be Jeff and Rick dealing with it as much as the person who said it, and they choose not to. The situations are not really the same. I have NO PROBLEM with Denny speaking his mind, in fact I'm for it, but you also have to know your place. In my professional situation, I am the second longest tenured active employee in the company. That gives me far more leeway to go off the reservation than most of my far less senior co-workers. Denny's "place" is far different than the current four HMS drivers.
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Jeffy should let his corporate culture speak itself....and the Felon should take care of his own house...although he did a masterful job of neutering Ross. Well played. I don't hear Coach talking about other drivers. This is Jeffy trying to get into Denny's head. He is worried about the 11. You kind of lost me on the rest of it....but I kind of get where you are going.
 
jaqua19 said:
Rev, IIRC, you were the loudest supporter of Larson's willingness to grow from his mistake back in 2021 and seemed pretty appreciative of his efforts to become a better person.

Now it seems like your using that as a character flaw?

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I don't think I was so much about Larson and his transformation. He is a brand like all of the others. His brand suggests change. I don't know who he is in his living room. I am sure that Jeffy and Chadly have had conversations with him about who to be to promote the brand. He has been successful at that, but I am sure that he is accountable to them, and his contract no doubt reflects that. The Felon probably checks out his game controller to him.
 
AlTerego said:
Rick was indicted for purchasing an extra allocation of Honda vehicles. It's standard practice as the factory reps normally hold an unofficial auction for the extra vehicles. Should that bother you or me? Should we be concerned about Gene Haas' attempting to cheat the American taxpayer? If not, why not?
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Was it legal? Thanks.
 
Revman said:
I don't think I was so much about Larson and his transformation. He is a brand like all of the others. His brand suggests change. I don't know who he is in his living room. I am sure that Jeffy and Chadly have had conversations with him about who to be to promote the brand. He has been successful at that, but I am sure that he is accountable to them, and his contract no doubt reflects that. The Felon probably checks out his game controller to him.
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I distinctly remember you supporting the change and talking about your belief in second chances if it means people grow.

Yeah, a brand. But these were the words of our good buddy Revman, and I remember reading them ;)

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jaqua19 said:
I distinctly remember you supporting the change and talking about your belief in second chances if it means people grow.

Yeah, a brand. But these were the words of our good buddy Revman, and I remember reading them ;)

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Yeah, I think we are saying the same thing....I get what you are saying...
 
Formerjackman said:
If you listen to people that actually KNOW something instead of mouthing pro-Toyota propaganda that would make Joe Goebbels blush, you would know that Jeff is regarded as a HIGHLY astute business person, respected by car owners, drivers, sponsors and NASCAR. Also notice that while applicants to be Rick's right hand man could have made a line circling Charlotte a couple of times, it was Rick that literally BEGGED Jeff to quit his TV gig to take the job. He COULD have Jimmie, or Chad, or Dale Jr, Kelley, or a thousand others, but he wanted JEFF. That alone ought to tell you something. It's a shame your TuRD colored glasses won't let you see the obvious.
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I couldn't care less about what those people say. I can't stand the guy. He acted like an ass over the louvers then went back into his hole over the greenhouse....with Chadly in tow trying to gain the favor of the Felon. A pathetic clown show. Where the hell is 50% of that team? Planning snowboarding vacations and working on a dirt schedule. Doesn't look like quality management to me...but I will take it....make it easier for MY Toyotas to take 50% of the Round of 8. I hope Jeffy keeps running things as he has. I like it. How in the hell do SOU sing the praises of The Felon when it was JGR/Toyota who dominate the Round of 8? Oh, yeah, The Narrative.
 
jaqua19 said:
Denny made a comment to Dale Jr recently stating he'd retire if he moved from Gibbs to a lesser team because he'd be exposed, and states he isn't a top 100 talent in American motorsports basically.

I find that to be ridiculous. Denny may not have the raw talent of a handful of other championship caliber drivers.

But he absolutely has the best racecraft in the series, and is an exceptional racecar driver.

He's just a **** head.

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I agree on the racecraft along with a couple of other cup veterans, and that's just Denny being hard on himself, sounds like.

I was all set to like the post until the last line, how do you know what Denny is really like?
Have you ever spent a day with him? This is common with fans and fans of celebrities, someone they have in their mind that they hate or think is a certain way, they show up in real life to meet them and surprise they're actually really good to them and their opinion changes on the spot, or someone they thought they liked ends up being not the guy they thought he was and bing they no longer have such an affinity for that guy.

I mean it's fine to form these opinions on someone's character as a fan from afar over the years I guess, keeps people interested, so long as there's a realization they probably don't really know the guy behind the scenes.


Other than that, I pretty much agree with everything else you're saying here in this thread, as you make a lot of good posts here jaqua, and I enjoy reading them you put out good insight.
 
Turtle84 said:
I agree on the racecraft along with a couple of other cup veterans, and that's just Denny being hard on himself, sounds like.

I was all set to like the post until the last line, how do you know what Denny is really like?
Have you ever spent a day with him? This is common with fans and fans of celebrities, someone they have in their mind that they hate or think is a certain way, they show up in real life to meet them and surprise they're actually really good to them and their opinion changes on the spot, or someone they thought they liked ends up being not the guy they thought he was and bing they no longer have such an affinity for that guy.

I mean it's fine to form these opinions on someone's character as a fan from afar over the years I guess, keeps people interested, so long as there's a realization they probably don't really know the guy behind the scenes.


Other than that, I pretty much agree with everything else you're saying here in this thread, as you make a lot of good posts here jaqua, and I enjoy reading them you put out good insight.
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There's exceptions (Jr is really a hell of a guy off track, and I HAVE met him), but I typically rate on track performance as more important just because like you said that's all we typically really know about them, but not necessarily the only thing to consider as to being a fan a guy. Not that they even have to win to like them (I was a Byron fan for a long damn time before he finally started winning - not a bandwagoner), but they probably should be serviceable, thought again there are always exceptions.
 
Turtle84 said:
I agree on the racecraft along with a couple of other cup veterans, and that's just Denny being hard on himself, sounds like.

I was all set to like the post until the last line, how do you know what Denny is really like?
Have you ever spent a day with him? This is common with fans and fans of celebrities, someone they have in their mind that they hate or think is a certain way, they show up in real life to meet them and surprise they're actually really good to them and their opinion changes on the spot, or someone they thought they liked ends up being not the guy they thought he was and bing they no longer have such an affinity for that guy.

I mean it's fine to form these opinions on someone's character as a fan from afar over the years I guess, keeps people interested, so long as there's a realization they probably don't really know the guy behind the scenes.


Other than that, I pretty much agree with everything else you're saying here in this thread, as you make a lot of good posts here jaqua, and I enjoy reading them you put out good insight.
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When I refer to him as a ****head, I am of course reacting to his NASCAR persona.

My bad for not specifying, but I think when we make "character judgements" against drivers, it's against them as drivers, and not as human beings.

Kyle Busch was an insufferable, arrogant brat for a while.

He also is clearly a great father and a great husband based on what we know.

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Revman said:
I couldn't care less about what those people say. I can't stand the guy. He acted like an ass over the louvers then went back into his hole over the greenhouse....with Chadly in tow trying to gain the favor of the Felon. A pathetic clown show. Where the hell is 50% of that team? Planning snowboarding vacations and working on a dirt schedule. Doesn't look like quality management to me...but I will take it....make it easier for MY Toyotas to take 50% of the Round of 8. I hope Jeffy keeps running things as he has. I like it. How in the hell do SOU sing the praises of The Felon when it was JGR/Toyota who dominate the Round of 8? Oh, yeah, The Narrative.
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Who gives a crap about " dominating the Round of 8"? Where is the check and the trophy for that?
 
Revman said:
Jeffy should let his corporate culture speak itself....and the Felon should take care of his own house...although he did a masterful job of neutering Ross. Well played. I don't hear Coach talking about other drivers. This is Jeffy trying to get into Denny's head. He is worried about the 11. You kind of lost me on the rest of it....but I kind of get where you are going.
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Was Coach ASKED about other drivers? The only person that gets into Denny's head is Denny.
 
Revman said:
I couldn't care less about what those people say. I can't stand the guy. He acted like an ass over the louvers then went back into his hole over the greenhouse....with Chadly in tow trying to gain the favor of the Felon. A pathetic clown show. Where the hell is 50% of that team? Planning snowboarding vacations and working on a dirt schedule. Doesn't look like quality management to me...but I will take it....make it easier for MY Toyotas to take 50% of the Round of 8. I hope Jeffy keeps running things as he has. I like it. How in the hell do SOU sing the praises of The Felon when it was JGR/Toyota who dominate the Round of 8? Oh, yeah, The Narrative.
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Whether you like Jeff Gordon or not has absolutely NOTHING to do with abilities. That's where your brand of fandom loses me.
 
Formerjackman said:
Whether you like Jeff Gordon or not has absolutely NOTHING to do with abilities. That's where your brand of fandom loses me.
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Your perception of his abilities has EVERYTHING to do with yours.
 
This sport is about winning races, championships and making money.

Gordon won 93 races and 4 championships. I'm not going to give his ownership credit for the 7 48 championships.

But since he's been involved in the organization, HMS has won back to back championships, won the regular season the following year, and has two favorites to win it again.

I don't care about the philosophy, i don't care about manufacture, hell, I hardly care for race teams - I'm a driver guy. Chevy, Ford, Toyota. Don't care. But facts are facts and HMS is the dominant force in NASCAR right now. They're doing something right.

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jaqua19 said:
This sport is about winning races, championships and making money.

Gordon won 93 races and 4 championships. I'm not going to give his ownership credit for the 7 48 championships.

But since he's been involved in the organization, HMS has won back to back championships, won the regular season the following year, and has two favorites to win it again.

I don't care about the philosophy, i don't care about manufacture, hell, I hardly care for race teams - I'm a driver guy. Chevy, Ford, Toyota. Don't care. But facts are facts and HMS is the dominant force in NASCAR right now. They're doing something right.

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As a dominant force, it is they who should have four in the Round of 8. They don't. Why? Because Chasey and Cutie Pie want to play....Obviously, this superior organizational bull**** is a narrative that doesn't work. I'd also argue that they have been not dominant since they got legal....assuming that they now are.
 
jaqua19 said:
When I refer to him as a ****head, I am of course reacting to his NASCAR persona.

My bad for not specifying, but I think when we make "character judgements" against drivers, it's against them as drivers, and not as human beings.

Kyle Busch was an insufferable, arrogant brat for a while.

He also is clearly a great father and a great husband based on what we know.

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All good man that is good to know, honestly I think Denny is just having some fun with the persona.
 
BRB, gonna go find every public comment made by a JGR or TRD employee, and pick it apart to fit my narrative.

Oh, wait, I'm actually not, because I couldn't care less.
 
Revman said:
As a dominant force, it is they who should have four in the Round of 8. They don't. Why? Because Chasey and Cutie Pie want to play....Obviously, this superior organizational bull**** is a narrative that doesn't work. I'd also argue that they have been not dominant since they got legal....assuming that they now are.
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Your fixation with Chase and Alex not being in the playoffs is bordering on the obsessed and delusional. I guess if that's all you've got, knock yourself out with it, but what are you going to have if William or Kyle win it all anyway? I would have said WHEN, but I'm not that arrogant about MY race team, even if that team has had more success than your entire manufacturer.
 
Revman said:
Your perception of his abilities has EVERYTHING to do with yours.
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My perception of his abilities are irrelevant in this context. The perception of the people actually IN the sport IS relevant and they know what an asset he is to HMS and the sport as a whole.
 
Formerjackman said:
Your fixation with Chase and Alex not being in the playoffs is bordering on the obsessed and delusional. I guess if that's all you've got, knock yourself out with it, but what are you going to have if William or Kyle win it all anyway? I would have said WHEN, but I'm not that arrogant about MY race team, even if that team has had more success than your entire manufacturer.
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But but but Chasey Elliott and Cutie Pie Bowman can't win the championship this year!!!!! Obviously that means both of their careers are over and HMS will never recover!!!!!!!! :wacko:
 
The alter boy ty didnt make the playoffs and he is the future of Gibbs, doesn't look so bright!
 
Formerjackman said:
My perception of his abilities are irrelevant in this context. The perception of the people actually IN the sport IS relevant and they know what an asset he is to HMS and the sport as a whole.
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You are making this bigger than it is....He was an ass for commenting on somebody else's driver. My opinion. Don't care what anybody else thinks. Denny agrees with me. That's all I need.
 
Formerjackman said:
Your fixation with Chase and Alex not being in the playoffs is bordering on the obsessed and delusional. I guess if that's all you've got, knock yourself out with it, but what are you going to have if William or Kyle win it all anyway? I would have said WHEN, but I'm not that arrogant about MY race team, even if that team has had more success than your entire manufacturer.
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bull****. It is nothing less than an organizational fail to have two dominant cars out of the playoffs because of free time activities. Stop your hyperbole....obsessed and delusional are big words. Have you made similar claims about "Preacher" references? Careful on the bias as statements of fact.
 
2 Sweet said:
But but but Chasey Elliott and Cutie Pie Bowman can't win the championship this year!!!!! Obviously that means both of their careers are over and HMS will never recover!!!!!!!! :wacko:
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Chasey and Cutie Pie are very pouty. I am enjoying this. Snowboarding season is just around the corner. Chasey will be okay, and Cutie Pie has his hair to work on.
 
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