Hendrick Motorsport News

Revman said:
...and why won't the panel members talk? Why don't we know details? This is a ****** sport whose credibility is in the ****ter, and this handled like a right to privacy. bull****.
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Hey, I'm with you on this one, I want the damn thing televised to offer complete transparency to the process, I don't think you would get ANYONE actually involved in the process to agree to it, which is sad, but it's also another reason why it just doesn't make a lot of sense to get too worked up about what goes on there. I wish I had your energy to get this fired up over something as non-important as a NASCAR team getting or not getting a penalty. I don't think the panel members will ever talk, because I don't think they want to have to justify their decision to a bunch of rabid fans for the next twenty years. I think they SHOULD have to justify it, but they don't have to, so they won't. I wouldn't be surprised if part of the deal to get the gig is non- disclosure anyway.
 
Revman said:
Wrong. Search my post Pocono comments. WE broke a rule. Proud of OUR post penalty response unlike the entitled Hendrick jackasses.

Fact. Never defended nor deflected.
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My guess is the reason JGR decided not appeal had a LOT more to do with there being no legitimate avenue to defend what they did (the tape was THERE, no way to escape that it was or WHY it was there) than any sense of duty or honor. The HMS case CLEARLY had some gray areas to it and guess what, the panel AGREED. When the 9 car got caught caught red handed with tape on the spoiler, was there an appeal then? NO, because there was no room for argument. MY experience with HMS is that when they have not had a legitimate defense, they don't appeal. When they feel they DO have a legitimate defense, they will, which is probably why their appeal success rate is so high. This superior attitude crap doesn't fly with me when you are defending the team that put magnets under the accelerator to fool the NASCAR dynomometer.
 
Honestly, this entire conversation is moot. It operates under the assumption that 1) only the teams that are caught cheating were cheating, 2) the appeals panel is "fair" and goes into the hearings without any agenda, and 3) there isn't a metric sh!t ton of behind the scenes shadiness that ultimately affect most things in the sport, including stuff like this. So...if you take into account the reality of what actually goes on day in and day out versus what you read from Bob Pockrass tweets, my recommendation would be to just throw logic out the window, toss your hands in the air and just think to yourselves, "that's NASCAR!!!!" It's what everyone who works in the industry does.
 
Allenbaba said:
Honestly, this entire conversation is moot. It operates under the assumption that 1) only the teams that are caught cheating were cheating, 2) the appeals panel is "fair" and goes into the hearings without any agenda, and 3) there isn't a metric sh!t ton of behind the scenes shadiness that ultimately affect most things in the sport, including stuff like this. So...if you take into account the reality of what actually goes on day in and day out versus what you read from Bob Pockrass tweets, my recommendation would be to just throw logic out the window, toss your hands in the air and just think to yourselves, "that's NASCAR!!!!" It's what everyone who works in the industry does.
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Well said, sir. Thanks for your input!
 
Allenbaba said:
Honestly, this entire conversation is moot. It operates under the assumption that 1) only the teams that are caught cheating were cheating, 2) the appeals panel is "fair" and goes into the hearings without any agenda, and 3) there isn't a metric sh!t ton of behind the scenes shadiness that ultimately affect most things in the sport, including stuff like this. So...if you take into account the reality of what actually goes on day in and day out versus what you read from Bob Pockrass tweets, my recommendation would be to just throw logic out the window, toss your hands in the air and just think to yourselves, "that's NASCAR!!!!" It's what everyone who works in the industry does.
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Agree 100%. I've been a NASCAR fan for over 40 years now, and if you are waiting for things to be fair, logical, consistent or transparent, you will likely still be waiting when you die. It's like what I keep saying about cheating. It's been there from race #1, it's always going to be there, EVERYBODY does it, the more team owners decry it, the more they are probably doing it, EVERYBODY puts their own immediate needs and wants ahead of the sport and good sportsmanship and you can either accept it as it is, or go watch golf.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
And yet I somehow get the impression it's not as dirty behind the scenes as F1. It's definitely better than FIFA.
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Let me put it this way - team orders for who wins the race is essentially race fixing (really, it is, just try to justify it as not being that), but it is done straight up and in front of everyone. I'm sure there is really dirty stuff out there based on rumor threads elsewhere on the internet and the apparent total lack of community in F1.
 
Formerjackman said:
My guess is the reason JGR decided not appeal had a LOT more to do with there being no legitimate avenue to defend what they did (the tape was THERE, no way to escape that it was or WHY it was there) than any sense of duty or honor. The HMS case CLEARLY had some gray areas to it and guess what, the panel AGREED. When the 9 car got caught caught red handed with tape on the spoiler, was there an appeal then? NO, because there was no room for argument. MY experience with HMS is that when they have not had a legitimate defense, they don't appeal. When they feel they DO have a legitimate defense, they will, which is probably why their appeal success rate is so high. This superior attitude crap doesn't fly with me when you are defending the team that put magnets under the accelerator to fool the NASCAR dynomometer.
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We don't know the details....How could we know that they had a legit defense? We differ on why their appeals success is so high. JGR's claim was that the change in rule happened mid-week, and the word didn't get to the shop floor....communication.....Where have we heard that before? That tape had been fine until it wasn't, and somebody squawked. You might also recall that shortly after the penalty, they put a nose in front of their hauler with tape for all to see. Regardless....I am absolutely convinced that if HMS wanted to be within the rules, they would have been.
 
Allenbaba said:
Honestly, this entire conversation is moot. It operates under the assumption that 1) only the teams that are caught cheating were cheating, 2) the appeals panel is "fair" and goes into the hearings without any agenda, and 3) there isn't a metric sh!t ton of behind the scenes shadiness that ultimately affect most things in the sport, including stuff like this. So...if you take into account the reality of what actually goes on day in and day out versus what you read from Bob Pockrass tweets, my recommendation would be to just throw logic out the window, toss your hands in the air and just think to yourselves, "that's NASCAR!!!!" It's what everyone who works in the industry does.
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I completely disagree. From a fan's perspective, it's fun to bitch and whine and claim unfairness. Seriously. It's part of fandom even though there are some here that feel above it. Insiders such as yourself see this stuff through a different lens, and I respect that, but that lens is not mine. Chevy and Hendrick BS--real or imagined--deepens my dislike for them, and fuels my passion for the sport. Motorsports differs from stick and ball in many ways, but one of the most significant is in how rivalries are viewed and manifested. I hope that makes sense.
 
What happens in the garage all the time is that soon word gets around to Nascar as to what teams are doing. It's human nature.
Of course some say that doesn't happen aparently with the review panels. Under the cloak of darkness, dark money changes hands and in all of the years of the panel, not one member has spoken out about it.
 
I honestly think Nascar should leave points alone. Take away pit stall choice, start at the rear, Drive through penalties, Take away practice . Fines and n race penalties are fine with me. Taking points off the board is wrong in any sport.
Suppose HMS had to start at the rear and had last pick for pit stall for the next 5 races. I'd rather see that.
 
LibertyU24 said:
I honestly think Nascar should leave points alone. Take away pit stall choice, start at the rear, Drive through penalties, Take away practice . Fines and n race penalties are fine with me. Taking points off the board is wrong in any sport.
Suppose HMS had to start at the rear and had last pick for pit stall for the next 5 races. I'd rather see that.
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This penalty situation really ramped up with the new car. With every new change, situations arise that nobody thinks of.
It looks like Nascar is leaving it up to the manufacturers to have their parts made within tolerances. As with anything, if somebody isn't checking tolerances down the line, instead of the part being rejected in house, it gets sent out the door with "let the teams deal with it".
All the final inspections of parts and pieces should be Nascar's responsibility and it isn't that way. If Nascar isn't going to be responsible, they sure should have a well documented procedure teams can follow when they find a part that is out of spec. if they are going to hammer teams with these penalties.
 
StandOnIt said:
This penalty situation really ramped up with the new car. With every new change, situations arise that nobody thinks of.
It looks like Nascar is leaving it up to the manufacturers to have their parts made within tolerances. As with anything, if somebody isn't checking tolerances down the line, instead of the part being rejected in house, it gets sent out the door with "let the teams deal with it".
All the final inspections of parts and pieces should be Nascar's responsibility and it isn't that way. If Nascar isn't going to be responsible, they sure should have a well documented procedure teams can follow when they find a part that is out of spec. if they are going to hammer teams with these penalties.
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100%....and until this happens, don't **** with it....unless you are part of The Chain Gang.
 
Revman said:
"Who knows..." and then you insinuate. Kind of jacked up your own post. At least a month prior to Pocono. NASCAR issued something the Wednesday before Pocono, and then a "communication error" as The Chain Gang likes to call it.
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I don't know and you sure as hell don't know how long the yotas got away with it. I guess a yota like yourself could call it a coincidence that Hamlin didn't win a race after they found the infraction and he won 3 races before he did. At least with the Chevys, it didn't make any difference, no loss of performance.
 
Rick said:
If they weren't caught they all would have gained points during the race. Did they have these parts on in prior races? Guys they cheated. They didn't get a half million dollar fine for nothing. Grow up.
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Let's see what Jeffy and Chadly say about the HMS character assault now. Betcha they feel vindicated....even though the fine says that they did something wrong.
 
Rick said:
If they weren't caught they all would have gained points during the race. Did they have these parts on in prior races? Guys they cheated. They didn't get a half million dollar fine for nothing. Grow up.
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Well Byron dominated and won without it the next day. Doubt he would have gained many more points with it in that race.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Correct me if I'm wrong again, but isn't it a violation to just have the modified parts at the track, regardless of whether they're used or mounted?
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Yes, but nascaer told them to modify them to fit. Knowing they were going to do this Nascar should of said yes or no before any of this happened. On a similar note is it just Chevy getting ban parts? There is only one supplier so the other two should see discrepancies in tolerances and fit
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Correct me if I'm wrong again, but isn't it a violation to just have the modified parts at the track, regardless of whether they're used or mounted?
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I didn't know nascar had the authority to go through a hauler to look for illegal parts that aren't on the car?

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk
 
Well, I think this is news.......Willy B. thinks spinning people under caution is respectful. In perfect Chain Gang tradition....Speak it into truth. Young man has learned his lessons well.

 
It looks like Nascar set them up. Throw some red meat in front of Knaus, tell him it is OK to modify the louvers to fit the hood, wait awhile without checking up on him and pocket 400 thousand when he shows up at the track.
 
Revman said:
Well, I think this is news.......Willy B. thinks spinning people under caution is respectful. In perfect Chain Gang tradition....Speak it into truth. Young man has learned his lessons well.

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Top of the playoff standings for Byron. He and crew chief X-yota Rudy Fugle are firing on all eight. :headbang:
 
Revman said:
Here's my research courtesy of NBC Sports....

"The Appeals Panel did not give a reason for its decision."

Your turn.
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Here's mine: Here's some more red story meat for ya Rev.







  • “I think it’s a terrible situation, not only for us, but the industry to be quite honest with you,” Knaus said. “I think that’s what I dislike the most. It’s ugly. We should’t be in this situation and it’s really unfortunate that we are because it doesn’t help anybody.”
    Asked to explain, Knaus said: “We as a company, we in the garage, every one of these teams here are being held accountable to put their car out there to go through inspection and perform at the level they need to. The teams are being held accountable for doing that.
    “Nobody is holding the single-source providers accountable at the level that they need to be to give us the parts we need. That goes through NASCAR’s distribution center and NASCAR’s approval process to get those parts, and we’re not getting the right parts.
    “There’s so many areas that we’ve got to continue to improve upon,” Knaus said, referring to the sport. “Again, that’s where I’m probably most disappointed is that we’ve been going down this path, working collectively as a group for some time and for this to pop up like this is really disappointing.”
    Elton Sawyer, NASCAR senior vice president of competition, said earlier this week that the hood louvers had been modified.
    “It was obvious to us that these parts had been modified in an area that wasn’t approved,” Sawyer said. “This is a consistent penalty with what we went through last year. … We felt like to keep the garage on a level playing field and the competition level where it needs to be, all the dialogue that went around this car last year, working with the owners on what the deterrent model should be, we were put in a position where we felt there was no other way but to write a penalty.”
    Asked if the modifications could impact downforce, Sawyer said: “We don’t normally get into the intent, but I think it’s fair to say … could be performance around these modifications.”


    In its statement earlier this week, Hendrick Motorsports cited “documented inconsistent and unclear communication by the sanctioning body specifically related to louvers.”
    Asked to clarify those communications, Knaus said: “We submitted a part through (Chevrolet) to NASCAR and then NASCAR chose the single-source provider for those components.
    “The components haven’t been coming the way we expected them to be for a couple of the (manufacturers) as far as I know in the garage and definitely all of the Chevrolet teams, so we started to have dialogue with them (NASCAR) in early February about those problems.
    “It was us through our aerodynamic department, through (Chevrolet), back through NASCAR, back to us and back to (Chevrolet). There’s a significant amount of communication that has been had. It’s definitely confusing. The timelines are curious but they are there.”
    Knaus said that Hendrick Motorsports typically goes through a voluntary inspection at the track after going through the mandatory engine inspection and mandatory safety inspection shortly after the garage opens for the race weekend. That’s what the Hendrick cars did at Phoenix on March 10.
    Knaus said that the Hendrick cars often go through the voluntary inspection “so NASCAR has the opportunity to say, ‘Hey, we don’t like this’ or ‘Maybe you need to tweak that’ or whatever it may be. That’s been pretty much the standard cadence.”
    Hendrick Motorsports stated this week that the louvers were not taken until four hours after going through that voluntary inspection. Knaus said he did not know why NASCAR did not do something immediately.
    “It’s really confusing,” Knaus said. “We knew that there was some attention to that area when we first went through technical inspection. That’s what is really disappointing to me, quite honestly, is that we had plenty of time to get the parts off the car if we felt something was wrong.
    “I can assure you if we knew there was going to be a four-hour lag and we thought there was something wrong, they would have been in a trash can being burned with fuel somewhere so nobody would ever see them. We had no idea that we were going to be sitting in this position. Really disappointed that we are in the position that we are right now.”
    Asked if he felt the parts were faulty or that Hendrick modified the parts that they thought was acceptable to NASCAR, Knaus said: “We’ve got a brand new set of these parts that we can go pull off of the shelf right now that NASCAR deemed illegal and inappropriate for us to race.”
 
StandOnIt said:
Here's mine: Here's some more red story meat for ya Rev.







  • “I think it’s a terrible situation, not only for us, but the industry to be quite honest with you,” Knaus said. “I think that’s what I dislike the most. It’s ugly. We should’t be in this situation and it’s really unfortunate that we are because it doesn’t help anybody.”
    Asked to explain, Knaus said: “We as a company, we in the garage, every one of these teams here are being held accountable to put their car out there to go through inspection and perform at the level they need to. The teams are being held accountable for doing that.
    “Nobody is holding the single-source providers accountable at the level that they need to be to give us the parts we need. That goes through NASCAR’s distribution center and NASCAR’s approval process to get those parts, and we’re not getting the right parts.
    “There’s so many areas that we’ve got to continue to improve upon,” Knaus said, referring to the sport. “Again, that’s where I’m probably most disappointed is that we’ve been going down this path, working collectively as a group for some time and for this to pop up like this is really disappointing.”
    Elton Sawyer, NASCAR senior vice president of competition, said earlier this week that the hood louvers had been modified.
    “It was obvious to us that these parts had been modified in an area that wasn’t approved,” Sawyer said. “This is a consistent penalty with what we went through last year. … We felt like to keep the garage on a level playing field and the competition level where it needs to be, all the dialogue that went around this car last year, working with the owners on what the deterrent model should be, we were put in a position where we felt there was no other way but to write a penalty.”
    Asked if the modifications could impact downforce, Sawyer said: “We don’t normally get into the intent, but I think it’s fair to say … could be performance around these modifications.”


    In its statement earlier this week, Hendrick Motorsports cited “documented inconsistent and unclear communication by the sanctioning body specifically related to louvers.”
    Asked to clarify those communications, Knaus said: “We submitted a part through (Chevrolet) to NASCAR and then NASCAR chose the single-source provider for those components.
    “The components haven’t been coming the way we expected them to be for a couple of the (manufacturers) as far as I know in the garage and definitely all of the Chevrolet teams, so we started to have dialogue with them (NASCAR) in early February about those problems.
    “It was us through our aerodynamic department, through (Chevrolet), back through NASCAR, back to us and back to (Chevrolet). There’s a significant amount of communication that has been had. It’s definitely confusing. The timelines are curious but they are there.”
    Knaus said that Hendrick Motorsports typically goes through a voluntary inspection at the track after going through the mandatory engine inspection and mandatory safety inspection shortly after the garage opens for the race weekend. That’s what the Hendrick cars did at Phoenix on March 10.
    Knaus said that the Hendrick cars often go through the voluntary inspection “so NASCAR has the opportunity to say, ‘Hey, we don’t like this’ or ‘Maybe you need to tweak that’ or whatever it may be. That’s been pretty much the standard cadence.”
    Hendrick Motorsports stated this week that the louvers were not taken until four hours after going through that voluntary inspection. Knaus said he did not know why NASCAR did not do something immediately.
    “It’s really confusing,” Knaus said. “We knew that there was some attention to that area when we first went through technical inspection. That’s what is really disappointing to me, quite honestly, is that we had plenty of time to get the parts off the car if we felt something was wrong.
    “I can assure you if we knew there was going to be a four-hour lag and we thought there was something wrong, they would have been in a trash can being burned with fuel somewhere so nobody would ever see them. We had no idea that we were going to be sitting in this position. Really disappointed that we are in the position that we are right now.”
    Asked if he felt the parts were faulty or that Hendrick modified the parts that they thought was acceptable to NASCAR, Knaus said: “We’ve got a brand new set of these parts that we can go pull off of the shelf right now that NASCAR deemed illegal and inappropriate for us to race.”
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This. Is. Nothing. You cite the lieutenant of the Chain Gang and use that as a statement of fact. Most of us here know that Chad has lied a time or 20 million in his career. Laughable. Hendrick was caught Hendricking, and got what they usually get. Nothing to see here, but don't make it into something it isn't.
 
Whiskyb said:
Yes, but nascaer told them to modify them to fit. Knowing they were going to do this Nascar should of said yes or no before any of this happened. On a similar note is it just Chevy getting ban parts? There is only one supplier so the other two should see discrepancies in tolerances and fit
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If we want to play the speculation game which is different from speculation taken as statements of fact....I will play. I am guessing as is @StandOnIt is that they were told to tweak, and they got engineers involved, and gained an advantage......They knew what they were doing.
 
Revman said:
This. Is. Nothing. You cite the lieutenant of the Chain Gang and use that as a statement of fact. Most of us here know that Chad has lied a time or 20 million in his career. Laughable. Hendrick was caught Hendricking, and got what they usually get. Nothing to see here, but don't make it into something it isn't.
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I posted it so other posters could see the reasons why the whole penalty wasn't enforced. You on the other hand lol.
 
StandOnIt said:
I posted it so other posters could see the reasons why the whole penalty wasn't enforced. You on the other hand lol.
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You post that **** when the reasoning is unknown. Again, per NBC... I really couldn't give a ****. I posted that I expected this to happen. What makes me puke is the Chain Gang Love Fest. Adds intrigue though....if WE are going to win this Championship, it is going to take a lot to overcome the fact that The Chain Gang are fast and that they have NASCAR in their hip pockets. I love being the underdog. Great race last weekend. Looking forward to another this weekend. Good luck to your 10 car.
 
Revman said:
You post that **** when the reasoning is unknown. Again, per NBC... I really couldn't give a ****. I posted that I expected this to happen. What makes me puke is the Chain Gang Love Fest. Adds intrigue though....if WE are going to win this Championship, it is going to take a lot to overcome the fact that The Chain Gang are fast and that they have NASCAR in their hip pockets. I love being the underdog. Great race last weekend. Looking forward to another this weekend. Good luck to your 10 car.
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Good luck with your ranting. It won't change a thing lol.
 
Whiskyb said:
Second last paragraph of this interview shows nascar is allowing them to modify parts, which most say is not allowed. It was determined that Hendrick went to far. The car was brought to the voluntary pre-inspection, possibly because they knew parts were modified. It was not till after practice NASCAR acted after practice

www.speedwaydigest.com/index.php/news/nascar-cup-series-news/76157-ncs-at-atlanta-hendrick-motorsports-jeff-andrews-and-chad-knaus-media-availability-transcript#close
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There's modifying....and then there's Hendrick modifying. It's clear that they took advantage of the ability to make the parts fit. They knew what they were doing, and they knew how they would defend themselves if they got caught. I will give The Chain Gang this....they were prepared.
 
There were 16 Chevrolet entries at Phoenix.

5 of them got caught up in this embarrassing situation. Did the others get mismanufactured louvers? If they did, did they alter them to NASCAR’s satisfaction?

The Spire thing seems rather odd … one legal louver and one illegal.
 
aunty dive said:
There were 16 Chevrolet entries at Phoenix.

5 of them got caught up in this embarrassing situation. Did the others get mismanufactured louvers? If they did, did they alter them to NASCAR’s satisfaction?

The Spire thing seems rather odd … one legal louver and one illegal.
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That is almost a third of the Chevy field...and Chad was saying the part didn't fit the CAD drawing..ya think?
 
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