State Of The Sport

Conover said:
Interesting article/conjecture on the state of the sport:

https://www.charlotteobserver.com/sports/nascar-auto-racing/thatsracin/article221945860.html
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This really hit home --- the bold is mine.

"In NASCAR, how do you reduce a 500 lap race to a 10-second highlight? With 40 drivers all doing their own things, all engaged in their own unique battles for track position and points, how do you judge who gets into the highlight, and when?

Simply put, as American sports fandom evolves — or devolves, depending on whom you ask — from a complex, comprehensive look at sporting events to a scoring-happy, fantasy-driven mindset, the product NASCAR delivers isn’t built to adjust.

Rather than watch a three-hour race in its entirety, like Homestead for example, fans want the highlights. The Cliff’s Notes version of sports, if you will. We want water cooler conversation points, easily observed arguments we can then take and propagate to our friends and colleagues.

We watch games for fantasy scoring updates and memes on social media as much as for the sake of taking in the entire event — if not more so."
 
StandOnIt said:
I partially disagree, money to run in the lower series catches the eye of the higher ups, the potential sponsors, etc. Preece took all of his sponsor's yearly money budget to buy a ride in a Gibbs car.
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But that is not the same as having family money or the family having money.
Preece had just enough sponsor money to run a season in a back marker. He gambled and placed it all on the line that in great equipment, he was just as good. as the others.
Now he has a cup ride but NOT in Gibbs equipment which means what?
 
Team Penske said:
But that is not the same as having family money or the family having money.
Preece had just enough sponsor money to run a season in a back marker. He gambled and placed it all on the line that in great equipment, he was just as good. as the others.
Now he has a cup ride but NOT in Gibbs equipment which means what?
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Which means he won't go anywhere unless a top tier team picks him up.
 
A sobering piece of prose that I hope the super positive members will weigh in on and refute. 9 buck last minute tickets to a non sold out finale! Ouch!!
 
IanMcVittie said:
A sobering piece of prose that I hope the super positive members will weigh in on and refute. 9 buck last minute tickets to a non sold out finale! Ouch!!
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If you understood how tickets were sold that might be a decent troll. Scalpers buy up large lots to resell, ticketmaster is in hot water for letting that happen BTW for giving the scalpers preferential treatment. The scalpers sell theirs for more money when the other forms of ticket sales sell out. That is why Homestead said they are sold out. They did sell all of their tickets, the scalpers who bought them didn't.
 
Team Penske said:
But that is not the same as having family money or the family having money.
Preece had just enough sponsor money to run a season in a back marker. He gambled and placed it all on the line that in great equipment, he was just as good. as the others.
Now he has a cup ride but NOT in Gibbs equipment which means what?
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Driving somebodies else's car in cup for cup money, instead of building his own modified cars and racing for peanuts.
 
IanMcVittie said:
A sobering piece of prose that I hope the super positive members will weigh in on and refute. 9 buck last minute tickets to a non sold out finale! Ouch!!
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I guess this is but another one of these. Just because some kid reporter regurgitates what others have written doesn't make it so.
IanMcVittie said: ↑
Right or wrong I don’t think people have to be honest or factual which is a shame but it is how it is.

More trouble for Ticketmaster
I commend the Department Of Justice for opening an investigation into Live Nation’s anticompetitive behaviour and write to bring to your attention new investigative reporting and further lines of inquiry. The Canadian Broadcasting Channel conducted a new investigation that reveals the ways in which Ticketmaster appears to collude with ticket scalpers to sell higher volumes of tickets on its platform – distorting the marketplace and harming consumers in the process

http://ajournalofmusicalthings.com/more-trouble-for-ticketmaster/
 
TexasRaceLady said:
Simply put, as American sports fandom evolves — or devolves, depending on whom you ask — from a complex, comprehensive look at sporting events to a scoring-happy, fantasy-driven mindset, the product NASCAR delivers isn’t built to adjust
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This is powerful. I have not devolved, but extremely frustrated with those who have. This sport offers so much that cannot--should not--be condensed into a highlight reel. Look at last weekend....Anybody watching with patience would have seen Joey as a threat. He worried me the most on Sunday morning because of what went on Friday and Saturday. This is an example of the joy of the sport. When at track in person, celebrating a pole on Friday. BS'ing about lap times over dinner on Saturday night, and then, if you are lucky, celebrating a win on Sunday night. These stupid ass "enhanced weekends" are such bull****. NASCAR trying to appease a fan they do not know, and probably never will. They take a day away. bull****. I think that it is conceivable with some exceptions such as myself, NASCAR may not be able to regain--or maybe gain, depending upon your perception--the fan who sees a race weekend in its entirety and takes huge joy in that as I do. What a shame, but this is the world we live in I suppose, and maybe this is an area NASCAR cannot fix.
 
It is a shame this post has "devolved" into yet another **** post flame for those who have their pet agendas to vent the same ol same ol stuff. Nascar is under new leadership if some can pry themselves away from their singleness of repetitive purposes. I really doubt if any have even read the whole transcript or the video that was posted, but they swallowed the other hook line and sinker. But it does accomplish it's intended purpose, covers all the pet gripes, even if it has been said a hundreds of times cut and paste.
 
Revman said:
This is powerful. I have not devolved, but extremely frustrated with those who have. This sport offers so much that cannot--should not--be condensed into a highlight reel. Look at last weekend....Anybody watching with patience would have seen Joey as a threat. He worried me the most on Sunday morning because of what went on Friday and Saturday. This is an example of the joy of the sport. When at track in person, celebrating a pole on Friday. BS'ing about lap times over dinner on Saturday night, and then, if you are lucky, celebrating a win on Sunday night. These stupid ass "enhanced weekends" are such bull****. NASCAR trying to appease a fan they do not know, and probably never will. They take a day away. bull****. I think that it is conceivable with some exceptions such as myself, NASCAR may not be able to regain--or maybe gain, depending upon your perception--the fan who sees a race weekend in its entirety and takes huge joy in that as I do. What a shame, but this is the world we live in I suppose, and maybe this is an area NASCAR cannot fix.
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Enhanced weekends are celebrated by the insiders in the sport IMO, not the fans. Nascar needs to be working harder, not laying down. If they can get away from the ISC's stranglehold of track contracts and be free to run more races in different areas and times hopefully at smaller tracks to attract more grass roots fans. Phelps mentioned mid week racing as being on the table along with smaller tracks and more road courses. those are crowd pleasers.
 
I’m disappointed that none of the Nascar positive people have tackled the meat of the article and refuted claims like Nascar doesn’t lend itself to be consumed like people consume sports today. If people don’t give a fig about pit, fuel and tire strategies where do you go?
 
IanMcVittie said:
I’m disappointed that none of the Nascar positive people have tackled the meat of the article and refuted claims like Nascar doesn’t lend itself to be consumed like people consume sports today. If people don’t give a fig about pit, fuel and tire strategies where do you go?
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meat of what article? The one from a 20 something reporter. or from the new president of Nascar? here is what the new president said. It is in the transcript.

Our digital and social numbers are doing incredibly well. They're through the roof.
 
That article from the Charlotte Observer was perfect. It’s why it’s so hard to gain current fans when the act of a race is nothing like other sports. Really with the exception of passing only crashes and the win are the must see moments.

Therefore the only way is to bring Martinsville type racing to all tracks via the ability to draft on all tracks
 
Mispeedway15 said:
That article from the Charlotte Observer was perfect. It’s why it’s so hard to gain current fans when the act of a race is nothing like other sports. Really with the exception of passing only crashes and the win are the must see moments.

Therefore the only way is to bring Martinsville type racing to all tracks via the ability to draft on all tracks
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The only way to have Martinsville racing is to have more short tracks.
 
K
StandOnIt said:
meat of what article? The one from a 20 something reporter. or from the new president of Nascar? here is what the new president said. It is in the transcript.

Our digital and social numbers are doing incredibly well. They're through the roof.
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What do you think about the train of thought that says Nascar races are not set up the way modern audiences want to consume sports.

When you speak of the Nascar prez do you mean the one that says Nascar doesn’t have a sponsorship problem?
 
Mispeedway15 said:
That article from the Charlotte Observer was perfect. It’s why it’s so hard to gain current fans when the act of a race is nothing like other sports. Really with the exception of passing only crashes and the win are the must see moments.

Therefore the only way is to bring Martinsville type racing to all tracks via the ability to draft on all tracks
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we will see if that happens next year. It's a big change.
 
Mopardh9 said:
:XXROFL:
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We’ve got a lecture about Ticketmaster but no reason for why Homestead didn’t sell out or no one wanted the scalpers tickets. I am not optimistic about getting an answer about Nascar and today’s fans
 
IanMcVittie said:
K


What do you think about the train of thought that says Nascar races are not set up the way modern audiences want to consume sports.

When you speak of the Nascar prez do you mean the one that says Nascar doesn’t have a sponsorship problem?
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Nascar will always have a sponsorship problem bud. yawn.
 
IanMcVittie said:
We’ve got a lecture about Ticketmaster but no reason for why Homestead didn’t sell out or no one wanted the scalpers tickets. I am not optimistic about getting an answer about Nascar and today’s fans
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That's ok they will make an excuse to suit their needs. Bottom line is that race should of sold out, it didnt.
 
Charlotte Observer Reporter said:
Rather than watch a three-hour race in its entirety, like Homestead for example, fans want the highlights. The Cliff’s Notes version of sports, if you will. We want water cooler conversation points, easily observed arguments we can then take and propagate to our friends and colleagues.

We watch games for fantasy scoring updates and memes on social media as much as for the sake of taking in the entire event — if not more so."
Click to expand...
I don't know how many people want to consume sports that way or who they are... and I doubt Brendan Marks does either. He offers no evidence, no expertise, no research. Really, he just asserts that he has figured out the sports fan population, and it has no appetite for anything beyond the 10-seconds highlight that fits on a GIF and can be tweeted.

That's not how I consume sports. I want to understand the event and its context. I want to follow the ebb and flow of the competition, and savor the nuances. Maybe that's just me..??

But if Brendan Marks is correct... so what? A sporting event cannot be structured to just be a highlight and nothing else. A batter can't hit a game-winning home run in every trip to the plate. And if he could do that, what would the Brendan Marks-type fan think of that? What is it about his assertion of the new world order that is actionable by racers?

Nascar will race on. And if Nascar doesn't, then the Outlaws and MotoGP will. And if they don't either, then someone will somewhere... and I'll be there until I can't any longer.
 
Give em enough rope they hang themselves. Buh buh day was still sellin tickets. We don no nothin bout ticketmaster.

NASCAR season finale at Homestead-Miami Speedway sold out
https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...t-homestead-miami-speedway-sold-out/94090260/

Ford EcoBoost 400 sold out at Homestead-Miami
https://www.nascar.com/news-media/2016/11/18/ford-ecoboost-400-sold-out-at-homestead-miami/

https://www.foxsports.com/nascar/st...nale-final-race-2015-sprint-cup-season-110615
https://www.foxsports.com/nascar/st...nale-final-race-2015-sprint-cup-season-110615


Mopardh9 said:
If Nascar can't sell out their 7th game moment or their Superbowl Daytona, I don't care how you spin it, they are in trouble.
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here ya go Moonbeam. In order to be at least a half decent troll, the lies have to have a sliver of truth to them to get by here it seems instead of a bald face lie.


Stadium tickets for 60th annual Daytona 500 sold out
 
The thread was about Steve Phelps' conference with reporters, and the subjects they discussed with regard to NASCAR's new leadership.

The Brendon Marks article that has derailed that topic is a pedestrian reciting of familiar points with a bizarre conclusion. He is likely correct in the final paragraph that the casual millions of non-fans will not come back to NASCAR no matter what they do. If so, why spend all of this time wringing hands about how racing isn't "good enough" or structured to attract people who aren't interested anyway?

People who enjoy motorsports watch it for the unique thrill of racing. They don't spend time wishing it were more like football and basketball. That was Brian France's vision, to morph auto racing to be more like the sports he enjoyed. He was a moron.
 
StandOnIt said:
Give em enough rope they hang themselves. Buh buh day was still sellin tickets. We don no nothin bout ticketmaster.

NASCAR season finale at Homestead-Miami Speedway sold out
https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...t-homestead-miami-speedway-sold-out/94090260/

Ford EcoBoost 400 sold out at Homestead-Miami
https://www.nascar.com/news-media/2016/11/18/ford-ecoboost-400-sold-out-at-homestead-miami/

https://www.foxsports.com/nascar/st...nale-final-race-2015-sprint-cup-season-110615
https://www.foxsports.com/nascar/st...nale-final-race-2015-sprint-cup-season-110615




here ya go Moonbeam. In order to be at least a half decent troll, the lies have to have a sliver of truth to them to get by here it seems instead of a bald face lie.


Stadium tickets for 60th annual Daytona 500 sold out
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Ok dude I've had enough of your condescending bullshiit, if it sold out why weren't the seats filled? Sure ticket master owned those tickets, but they didn't put butts in the seats. Same thing happened here with the so called sell outs at Fenway, we all knew it was a sham. Why couldn't ticket master sell those tickets?
 
Mopardh9 said:
Ok dude I've had enough of your condescending bullshiit, if it sold out why weren't the seats filled? Sure ticket master owned those tickets, but they didn't put butts in the seats. Same thing happened here with the so called sell outs at Fenway, we all knew it was a sham. Why couldn't ticket master sell those tickets?
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:XXROFL:Lets address your lies first :p It goes to credibility, you can't get by with that here no matter how you huff and puff. Some fans have access to the infield, some leave after the first stage, on and on. A good seat counter should know that and wait until it isn't sold out and do your snarking. heh heh in both of the racing tracks, your 0 for 2 bud.
 
IanMcVittie said:
We’ve got a lecture about Ticketmaster but no reason for why Homestead didn’t sell out or no one wanted the scalpers tickets. I am not optimistic about getting an answer about Nascar and today’s fans
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Nascar has some events that have attendance problems, others that pull a big crowd, and some that are sold out. Homestead was sold out. When 'Chicken Little' cried every damn day that the sky is falling, the other chicks soon tuned her out... just sayin'. But a few will come on here and claim ticket sales failed, even when they were sold out. It's easy to see what the agenda is when that happens.
 
Last Sunday's NASCAR Cup Series finale from Homestead earned a 2.5 rating and 4.15 million viewers on NBC, down 11% in ratings and viewership from last year (2.8, 4.66M) and down 29% and 32% respectively from 2016 (3.5, 6.08M).[More](11-23-2018)

Phoenix TV ratings UPDATE: NBC earned a 2.1 overnight rating for Sunday's Cup race at ISM Raceway.(11-12-2018)
UPDATE: The NASCAR Cup Series playoffs from Phoenix earned a 2.0 rating and 3.31 million viewers on NBCSN, down 9% in ratings and viewership from last year (2.2, 3.64M) and down 17% and 18% respectively from 2016 (2.4, 4.03M).[More](11-15-2018)


Texas TV ratings UPDATE: NBCSN earned a 1.5 overnight rating for Sunday's race from Texas Motor Speedway.(11-5-2018)
UPDATE: The NASCAR Cup Series playoffs from Texas earned a 1.4 rating and 2.27 million viewers on NBCSN last Sunday, down 13% in ratings and 16% in viewership from last year (1.6, 2.70M). The 2016 race was postponed due to rain, with rainout coverage earning a 1.1 and 1.86 million.[More](11-10-2018)

Martinsville TV ratings: NBCSN earned a 1.3 overnight rating for Sunday's race at Martinsville Speedway.(10-29-2018)
UPDATE: The NASCAR Cup Series playoffs from Martinsville (Va.) earned a 1.3 rating and 2.15 million viewers on NBCSN, down 24% in ratings and 22% in viewership from last year (1.7, 2.78M) and down 19% in both measures from 2016 (1.6, 2.67M).[More](11-3-2018)

Kansas TV ratings UPDATE: NBC earned a 1.8 overnight rating for Sunday's race from Kansas Speedway.(10-23-2018)
UPDATE: The NASCAR Cup Series playoffs from Kansas earned a 1.7 rating and 2.75 million viewers on NBC last Sunday, flat in ratings and down a fraction of a percent in viewership from last year on NBCSN (1.7, 2.76M), and down 19% and 20% respectively from 2016 on NBC (2.1, 3.45M).[More](10-28-2018)

Talladega TV ratings UPDATE: NBC earned a 2.2 overnight rating for racing at Talladega on Sunday.(10-15-2018)
UPDATE: The NASCAR Cup Series playoffs from Talladega (Ala.) earned a 2.2 rating and 3.51 million viewers on NBC last Sunday, down 21% in ratings and 26% in viewership from last year (2.8, 4.73M) and flat and down 2% respectively from 2016 on NBCSN (2.2, 3.58M).[More](10-20-2018)

Dover TV ratings UPDATE: NBCSN earned a 1.3 overnight rating for Sunday's race.(10-8-2018)
UPDATE: Sunday's NASCAR Cup Series playoffs at Dover had a 1.2 rating and 2.01 million viewers on NBCSN, down a tick in ratings and 2% in viewership from last year (1.3, 2.05M) and down 20% and 21% respectively from 2016 (1.5, 2.56M).[More](10-12-2018)

Charlotte TV ratings UPDATE: NBC earned a 1.99 overnight rating for Sunday afternoon's race on Charlotte Motor Speedway's inaugural ROVAL race.(10-4-2018)
UPDATE: The NASCAR Cup Series playoffs at Charlotte earned a 1.95 rating and 3.218 million viewers on NBC, up 6% in ratings and 13% in viewership from last year (1.8, 2.86M) and just the fourth Cup Series race all season to post an increase, joining Michigan, Chicagoland and Watkins Glen.[More](10-4-2018)

Richmond TV ratings UPDATE: NBCSN earned a 1.1 overnight rating for Saturday night's race.(9-24-2018)
UPDATE: Last Saturday's NASCAR Cup Series playoff race at Richmond (Va.) earned a 1.0 rating and 1.77 million viewers on NBCSN, down 17% in ratings and viewership from last year (1.2, 2.14M) and down 38% and 34% respectively from 2016 (1.6, 2.71M). Kyle Busch's win ranks as the lowest rated and least-watched NASCAR Cup Series race since at least 2000. [More](9-24-2018)

Las Vegas TV ratings UPDATE: NBCSN earned a 1.3 overnight rating for Sunday's race from Las Vegas Motor Speedway.(9-17-2018)
UPDATE: Last Sunday's NASCAR Cup Series playoff race at Las Vegas earned a 1.3 rating and 2.14 million viewers on NBCSN - down a tick in ratings and 7% in viewership from last year's playoff opener on the same weekend (Chicagoland: 1.4, 2.31M).[More](9-21-2018)

Indianapolis TV ratingsUPDATE: NBCSN earned 1.24 million viewers for Monday's postponed Brickyard 400.(9-13-2018)
UPDATE: Last year's race, which ran as scheduled in July, had 5.63 million on the NBC broadcast network. Earlier in the day, the delayed Xfinity Series race from the same track had 474,000.[More](9-16-2018)

Darlington TV ratings: NBCSN earned a 1.5 overnight rating for Sunday night's Cup race at Darlington.(9-4-2018)
UPDATE: Last Sunday's NASCAR Cup Series Southern 500 from Darlington earned a 1.5 rating and 2.66 million viewers on NBCSN, down 17% in ratings and 14% in viewership from last year (1.8, 3.10M) and down 46% and 43% respectively from 2016 on the NBC broadcast network (2.8, 4.64M).[More](9-6-2018)

Bristol TV ratings UPDATE: NBCSN earned a 1.4 overnight rating for Saturday night's Bass Pro NRA Night Race.(8-20-2018)
UPDATE: Saturday's NASCAR Cup Series Bristol Night Race earned a 1.4 rating and 2.33 million viewers on NBCSN, down 39% in ratings and viewership from last year on the NBC broadcast network (2.3. 3.82M) and down a third and 36% respectively from 2015, the last time it aired as scheduled on NBCSN (2.1, 3.61M).[More](8-23-2018)

Michigan TV ratings: NBCSN earned a 1.62 overnight rating for the Consumers Energy 400. The race faced big competition from the PGA Championship, which earned a 6.1[More](8-13-2018)

Notice a trend here? But the state of the sport couldn't be better.;)
 
LewTheShoe said:
Nascar has some events that have attendance problems, others that pull a big crowd, and some that are sold out. Homestead was sold out. When 'Chicken Little' cried every damn day that the sky is falling, the other chicks soon tuned her out... just sayin'. But a few will come on here and claim ticket sales failed, even when they were sold out. It's easy to see what the agenda is when that happens.
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If it was sold out why weren't the seats filled?
 
Here's how dopey the Marks article is. I watched the Turkey Night Grand Prix last night. I also watched part of the evening NFL game.

For those that don't know, that's a midget race on a dirt oval. It has been held every year over Thanksgiving since before the NBA existed and since a time when an NFL game consisted of a few completed forward passes per game.

Overnight TV ratings reveal that the NFL game was watched by an average of 17 million people. For all I know, the Turkey Night Grand Prix was watched by a total of 17,000. It probably wasn't much more, to be honest. Yet there were more than 70 cars in the pits, Kyle Larson and Christopher Bell were competing and having the time of their lives. I watched it from the comfort of my living room, just as I watched the NFL game before that.

Tell me more about how technology and how "we" consume sports is bad for racing and demands an existential crisis.
 
StandOnIt said:
:XXROFL:Lets address your lies first :p It goes to credibility, you can't get by with that here no matter how you huff and puff. Some fans have access to the infield, some leave after the first stage, on and on. A good seat counter should know that and wait until it isn't sold out and do your snarking. heh heh in both of the racing tracks, your 0 for 2 bud.
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At the singing of the National Anthem, into the first stage the seats weren't filled ...keep spinning dude you lose.
 
When some of you stop looking through your rose colored glasses and can acknowledge the sport is in trouble, let me know. Until then all I see is a bunch of excuses and not the truth.
 
I know that I don’t want to consume programming in 30 second increments but the reality is my opinion and that of many others here does not matter due to our age. Pity.
 
LewTheShoe said:
Nascar has some events that have attendance problems, others that pull a big crowd, and some that are sold out. Homestead was sold out. When 'Chicken Little' cried every damn day that the sky is falling, the other chicks soon tuned her out... just sayin'. But a few will come on here and claim ticket sales failed, even when they were sold out. It's easy to see what the agenda is when that happens.
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It is possible that every seat for Homestead was sold but the people that bought them could not resell them at a fraction of the cost. I won’t argue semantics but suffice it to say a conversation about this sort of thing should not exist.
 
IanMcVittie said:
I know that I don’t want to consume programming in 30 second increments but the reality is my opinion and that of many others here does not matter due to our age. Pity.
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It's hilarious watching the spin, I love NASCAR....i want it to survive and flourish, but I'm also a realist and see major problems in the sport where the apologists stick their heads in the sand and refuse to admit anything is wrong.
 
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