What exactly was better about NASCAR back in the day, and why was that way better?

[LewTheShoe]

The vibe around here has been brutally negative this off-season and I am genuinely interested to understand why. So explain to me like I'm a newbie what was better about Nascar 20 or 30 or 50 years ago, in your opinion. Why was that better? And is it something that Nascar could change if it wanted to, or natural evolution beyond the sport's ability to control?

One thing I liked about the 1970s and 80s is that the bodywork was tougher and more able to withstand light contact without loss of performance. A little beating and banging, or lightly brushing the wall was no big deal. I believe we could go back in that direction and racing would be better if we did.

Another thing I liked about the early days of Nascar was that it was more of a cottage industry, with many small teams competing and less domination by the big guys. It created more diversity and innovation. But that was always destined to change IMO. A job worth doing is worth doing well. Survival of the fittest is a natural evolution that cannot be thwarted. We should complain about things that can be controlled, and accept those that can't, IMO.

 

[Johali]

Today It's not racing, It's more like an old time medicine show.

 

[AndyMarquisLive]

I thought the racing was great in the 90s and early 2000s. Now, if you make even the slightest contact on a racetrack, you're out of the race because of the aerodynamic crap and how sensitive the cars are. Even ****** IndyCars, which are aerodynamic cars by design, aren't as sensitive as this Gen-6 car.

I keep hearing how good the racing was in the 60s and 70s but I look at the results pages on Racing-Reference and they paint a different picture. Don't get me wrong, I love short tracks and think running more of them would fix A LOT of problems in Cup, but there is way more parity in today's NASCAR. Although, that parity, which is the one big positive, is quickly disappearing as well with this new car.

 

[Charlie Spencer]

I think I can safely say that most people preferred a points system that crowned a champion based on consistent performance over the entire season, regardless of whether that champion won any races or secured the title before all the races were run.

As to complaining about things that can be controlled, there isn't much we as fans have control of.

And this is all I'm likely to say on this subject. I'm overdosed on all the " 'Member When?" discussions lately.

 

[Greg]

Bias ply tires.

 

[Greg]

No pit road speed limits in and out fast was a great thing to see. (but I understand why we can't do that anymore).

 

[KTMLew01]

Parity. If you win "too much" you are cheating. I loved it when Rusty was winning 10 races a season...and i'm not a Rusty Wallace fan. Seeing MM getting screwed over several times by the powers-that-be over minuscule issues. Society has gone all politically correct. People get all upset over teams pushing the rules. There are waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too many rules. LET>THEM>RACE!

 

[Greg]

Open trailers and crews that looked, and were Mill Hill Deluxe.

 

[kkfan91]

Being 26 the earliest season I really have memories of is 1997. That said I've never been a complainer, I like NASCAR now as much if not even more then I did then. But I'm a roll with the punches kind of person, I adapt well to change. Most people are not like that.

 

[Greg]

Cars that looked more like the show room.

 

[DIDIT]

This is my story and I am sticking to it....

First, years ago, NASCAR racing (any racing) was dangerous and fans attended because of that reason. No we did not want to see anyone injured or killed, but you knew watching these brave souls they were putting their lives on the line each time they strapped in.

Second, there was a connection between the fans and the drivers. When a race came to town, you might see the driver and his family eating at a local restaurant or shopping at a local store. I even ate breakfast with a driver at a local McDonalds one Sunday morning before the race. On another occasion the restaurant owner asked if we minded that DW and his wife sat at the table next to us. Ugh, what were we to say?

Third, on race day you might see a driver out and about and get a chance to talk to them before the race. You didn't need to purchase a "special" race ticket to get to participate in a canned interview with the driver and have no opportunity for a picture or autograph.

Fourth, during the race NASCAR didn't seem to throw fake cautions or "favor" a driver. Also,while dangerous, racing back to the line after the caution was many times very exciting.

Fifth, ticket prices and motel/hotel prices were reasonable with the exception of a few tracks.

Sixth, parking and tailgating have sometimes become costly and prohibitive...Years ago even at Daytona you could park for free on the street directly across from the speedway or at the Dog Track, walk the souvenir trailers and sponsor tents and come back to your vehicle and tailgate . Now you need a special permit to park close or be shuttled about one mile for free parking at Dayton making tailgating all but impossible.

Sixth, after the race the gate near the flag stand was opened and fans flocked down to victory lane and wandered around the pits and garage areas for hours after the race. Many times interacting with the driver or crews and picking up souvenirs such as used lug nuts in the pits.

Seventh, when I started going to NASCAR races you were not packed into the stands like sardines with 15" seats....Now we see that changing.

Eighth, TV was very limited and if you wanted to see a race in its entirety you almost always had to go the the race.

All that being said, a lot of people seem to be concerned about NASCAR's popularity. I for one, now find attending races much more enjoyable than back in the heyday of the late 90's and early 2000's as I can once again find reasonable motel rates (for the most part) and not have to sit for hours in traffic before and after the race. I just wished the drivers would be more accessible to the fans and the fans would give them the respect they need to do so.

 

[Greg]

Winston or RJ Reynolds

 

[29-4]

As another thread said, go back to 2003 and watch the season. Everything was great. Southern 500 hadn't been moved (though it being restored was great). Rockingham was still around. No Chase. Far fewer fake cautions.

 

[Greg]

Martinsville, North Wilkesboro, Richmond 5/8s fairgrounds, Nashville fairgrounds, Rockingham, and Darlington x 2, a unique Atlanta, Charlotte was even unique

 

[Greg]

Real exhaust pipes

 

[BobbyFord]

Manufactured drama sucks. The sport is just a bunch of gimmicks now. Over regulated and manipulated.
What's wrong with the sport? Brian France.

 

[ToyYoda]

I never really had a problem with NASCAR until the stupid elimination-style chase was introduced 3 years ago. Hell, in the 30-some odd years I've been watching NASCAR, 2011 was probably my 2nd favorite season behind only 1992. And conversely, there were some "back in the day" seasons that weren't so great.

 

[joe h]

The whole elimination playoff will likely prove to be the final nail. But the downfall started happening when drivers like mark Martin would move aside for slightly faster cars, instead of making them work for it. All that dumb ass strategy accomplishes is the slightly faster car never has to wear down his equipment. Then drivers started settling on their position, instead of battling for an extra spot or two. Now they would rather just 'finish' at Daytona and talladega, instead of actually putting on an entertaining show.

In the end they are going to find out that playing it safe, killed their golden egg laying goose.

 

[pjmolo]

Bias ply tires.

No pit road speed limits in and out fast was a great thing to see. (but I understand why we can't do that anymore).

Open trailers and crews that looked, and were Mill Hill Deluxe.

Cars that looked more like the show room.

Winston or RJ Reynolds

Martinsville, North Wilkesboro, Richmond 5/8s fairgrounds, Nashville fairgrounds, Rockingham, and Darlington x 2, a unique Atlanta, Charlotte was even unique

Real exhaust pipes

Greg, that's a great list but I couldn't be more disappointed in you for what you didn't say so I guess I'll just have to say it for you.

How 'bout some trophy girls . . .

 

[aunty dive]

Was there a sale on rose-colored glasses?

 

[kymartin6]

The whole elimination playoff will likely prove to be the final nail. But the downfall started happening when drivers like mark Martin would move aside for slightly faster cars, instead of making them work for it. All that dumb ass strategy accomplishes is the slightly faster car never has to wear down his equipment. Then drivers started settling on their position, instead of battling for an extra spot or two. Now they would rather just 'finish' at Daytona and talladega, instead of actually putting on an entertaining show.

In the end they are going to find out that playing it safe, killed their golden egg laying goose.

What the hell are you talking about mentioning the downfall started with Mark Martin? That's the biggest joke of a statement I have ever heard here.... If Mark had a good car he would fight for a position.. if he didn't..... had a piece of crap... he wouldn't hold up the line. You and I evidently watched different racing Joe.... As far as I was concerned..... Mark never had a ''dumb ass'' strategy... he was a straight-up racer that went out and raced as hard as what he could with the equipment he had.... You can just get on another subject as far as the downfall of Nascar.... no need to blame Mark.... That doesn't hold water.....

 

[R Clarence]

Racing was better when you left knowing you saw a good one. That’s how it was.

When it’s good, there is no need for a NASCAR shill, fearful of losing his/her hard card, explaining how great the motorsports entetainment of the past weekend was. That’s how it is.

 

[Greg]

No pansy Brian France around to screw up things. A case could be made that he doesn't even like racing. And he wouldn't be bringing back trophy queens with body parts this year if it wasn't part of Monster Energys program. POS has done everything possibile to castrate Nascar at all levels, and create a less appealing house broken product.

Less beastly cars and modest buttoned up trophy queens attired for a preist or a Jerry Falwell, is the work of a clueless dumbass.
Perez Hilton or Liberace would have probably respected and been a better steward for Nascar, than the birthrighted POS.

And a schedule most dominanted by 1.5 cookie cutters that resembles a single architects creation, is incredibly dumbass. As well as the attempted effed up rules to remedy the eff up.

And the chase sucks too, every iteration.

Last of all this is a serious post. There is is no unintended sarcasm. Every thought a serious one. Especially the disrespect for Brian France. He is the worse thing to ever happen to Nascar.

 

[BobbyFord]

No pansy Brian France around to screw up things. A case could be made that he doesn't even like racing. And he wouldn't be bringing back trophy queens with body parts this year if it wasn't part of Monster Energys program. POS has done everything possibile to castrate Nascar at all levels, and create a less appealing house broken product.

Less beastly cars and modest buttoned up trophy queens attired for a preist or a Jerry Falwell, is the work of a clueless dumbass.
Perez Hilton or Liberace would have probably respected and been a better steward for Nascar, than the birthrighted POS.

And a schedule most dominanted by 1.5 cookie cutters that resembles a single architects creation, is incredibly dumbass. As well as the attempted effed up rules to remedy the eff up.

And the chase sucks too, every iteration.

Last of all this is a serious post. There is is no unintended sarcasm. Every thought a serious one. Especially the disrespect for Brian France. He is the worse thing to ever happen to Nascar.

I hope the sport continues it's downward spiral. A true testament to the stupidity that is Brian France.

 

[pjmolo]

My take on good racing in NASCAR is something like how a Supreme Court justice described pornography years ago.

I can't really describe it but I'll know it when I see it . . .

 

[Skoalbandit33]

I will add to the mix and say I liked it when there were more teams plus engine builders and chassis makers plus crew chiefs were allowed a lot more latitude in setting up their car. I liked things better before restrictor plates, pit road speeds, radial tires and fuel injection. Having a greater variety of tracks and more short tracks suited me and I liked the more rag tag aspects of the series. Being able to talk to the drivers was cool and not really a big deal as it happened all the time. I could go on and on but that is my 2 cents worth for now.

 

[kymartin6]

I will add to the mix and say I liked it when there were more teams plus engine builders and chassis makers plus crew chiefs were allowed a lot more latitude in setting up their car. I liked things better before restrictor plates, pit road speeds, radial tires and fuel injection. Having a greater variety of tracks and more short tracks suited me and I liked the more rag tag aspects of the series. Being able to talk to the drivers was cool and not really a big deal as it happened all the time. I could go on and on but that is my 2 cents worth for now.

Couldn't have said it better myself........

 

[Skoalbandit33]

I hope the sport continues it's downward spiral. A true testament to the stupidity that is Brian France.

I am afraid that Brian has taken the series in such convoluted direction that irreparable damage has been done. Even if everyone from the boom years left the series still should have been able to handle the losses and gone back to business as usual but the newbies got bored and Nascar pissed off a lot of the old guard.

I belong to football and hockey forums and some of the members may take issue with the officiating or a certain team they don't like but they LOVE the game itself. On every racing forum I have been a part of there was always a strong contingent of people that had started to dislike Nascar for all sorts of reasons and it gets worse every year. Even with the latest round of changes most people on this forum said that they weren't as bad as they could have been" which is a joke in and of itself.

 

[BobbyFord]

I am afraid that Brian has taken the series in such convoluted direction that irreparable damage has been done. Even if everyone from the boom years left the series still should have been able to handle the losses and gone back to business as usual but the newbies got bored and Nascar pissed off a lot of the old guard.

I belong to football and hockey forums and some of the members may take issue with the officiating or a certain team they don't like but they LOVE the game itself. On every racing forum I have been a part of there was always a strong contingent of people that had started to dislike Nascar for all sorts of reasons and it gets worse every year. Even with the latest round of changes most people on this forum said that they weren't as bad as they could have been" which is a joke in and of itself.

People are growing complacent with Brian's BS meddling. More changes every year. The sport cannot survive with France at the helm. I wonder what other BS changes are in the future.

 

[NJJammer]

People are growing complacent with Brian's BS meddling. More changes every year. The sport cannot survive with France at the helm. I wonder what other BS changes are in the future.

Six changes to the format of determining the Champion in NASCAR since 2003. SIX!!! I am also a hockey fan and there have been adjustments and changes to the rules in the NHL since I've started watching but none of them have fundamentally changed the crowning of the sport's champion like the rule changes that Brian France and company (networks and other interests) have made to NASCAR.

 

[KTMLew01]

Crap...wrote a long GREAT post and poof...internet ate it.

 

[NJJammer]

I hope the sport continues it's downward spiral. A true testament to the stupidity that is Brian France.

While I don't hope the downward spiral continues, I have no faith that anything changes soon. I HOPE TO BE PROVED WRONG.

 

[kymartin6]

Crap...wrote a long GREAT post and poof...internet ate it.

I hate when that happens...... been there myself brother.......

 

[Greg]

Nascar use to accept a bad race or a run away by a dominant car. It is the price of integrity. I had a buddy years ago that was able to dominate, the promoter asked him not to make it look to easy. My buddy didnt listen and he stunk up the show.

Not every race is a going to be a classic. But there is nothing better when it hapens naturally. Thats when you know its real.

The Homestead final four reset like a late race debri bull**** is an insult. Everytime I hear an announcer talk about and promote the ****, I wish someone would kick their ass. Same goes for the "overtime" ass kissing too.

Racing doesnt need that crap, the drivers and the cars are the ****, the real just leave them alone let em race.

I wish people that couldn't handle a run away would take there own boring ass somewhere else. Too many accommodations have already been made already.

 

[kymartin6]

Boy 'O Boy are you right Greg that runaways happen... if you have a good car..... a good day and luck is on your side... let it roll!!!!!!!!!! Nascar seems to think that shouldn't happen. I really miss the days without the templates, the shock rules the rear gear rules.... the spoiler angle rules.. all the crap that makes it ''fair and honest''........ I wouldn't give you a quarter for ''fair and honest''..... Nascar got where it is now by inventiveness ..... not being Lilly White....

 

[Kiante]

Been watching as long as I can remember and I'm not as negative as some. I think race would be great with the current configuration of the gen-6 just lifted some off the ground, the spoiler size is good enough, less (no) splitter and use the valence underneath the car.

That splitter has to go, someone's race should not be gone because of a simple spin. Get rid of the throttle spacers as well.

Its such a simple fix, but we do not know if these changes would suit the dynamic of the gen-6 cars. I think the engineers can make it work.

 

[Bowtie3]

The best part about the old days was lack of Internet. As much as i like it here, social media and message boards/forums are a problem. People are afraid have their own thoughts anymore. While some still do think on their own, most are really just sheep who boo, cheer and complain to follow the crowd. Back then, if they didn't like it, they changed the channel. Now if people don't like it, they just log on and gripe about it. Back in the day, they just boo'ed the driver they hated and cheered the driver they loved.

 

[KTMLew01]

Nascar use to accept a bad race or a run away by a dominant car. It is the price of integrity. I had a buddy years ago that was able to dominate, the promoter asked him not to make it look to easy. My buddy didnt listen and he stunk up the show.

Not every race is a going to be a classic. But there is nothing better when it hapens naturally. Thats when you know its real.

The Homestead final four reset like a late race debri bull**** is an insult. Everytime I hear an announcer talk about and promote the sh!t, I wish someone would kick their ass. Same goes for the "overtime" ass kissing too.

Racing doesnt need that crap, the drivers and the cars are the sh!t, the real just leave them alone let em race.

I wish people that couldn't handle a run away would take there own boring ass somewhere else. Too many accommodations have already been made already.

It started going wrong when my man, AWESOME BILL ELLIOT, lapped the field TWICE at Talladega and won after pitting early & losing laps. They penalized the Ford every half dozen races. He still won. Pissed-off GM Owned NASCAR. GM was the only manufacturer that didn't completely pull out of NASCAR back in the day. The Dawsonville boys put a crimp in their style. Along come all kinds of rules changes for "parity". It's now a show. You used to have to win to afford to show up the full season or keep a sponsor. Not now. Rolling billboards.

 

[Greg]

Old BGN races at tracks like IRP were unmatched, and the Xfinity replacement crap at Indianapolis leaves an awful taste.

I am sorry for an any fan that didnt get to see Ingram, Ard, Houston, Ellis, Larry Pearson, Dale Jarrett, Lindley and others go at on a track like Hickory.
I remember one race at Hickory were Ingram and Tommy Houston were door to door for almost 75 laps for the lead, Larry Pearson eventually won that race.

Those races were as good as sex, and thats no exaggeration. In addition to this the cup drivers didnt need to be restrained. I saw Dale, DW and other one come to Hickory and get beat.

And the grandstands were packed too, it was an electric atmosphere. You left those races knowing it couldn't be any better. The race and the drivers were great.

 

[Greg]

It started going wrong when my man, AWESOME BILL ELLIOT, lapped the field TWICE at Talladega and won after pitting early & losing laps. They penalized the Ford every half dozen races. He still won. Pissed-off GM Owned NASCAR. GM was the only manufacturer that didn't completely pull out of NASCAR back in the day. The Dawsonville boys put a crimp in their style. Along come all kinds of rules changes for "parity". It's now a show. You used to have to win to afford to show up the full season or keep a sponsor. Not now. Rolling billboards.

I always enjoying the Ford people crying, that there is some vintage nascar itself.