NASCAR announces 2019 MENCS rules

Charlie Spencer said:
I didn't make my point very well. Let me try again.

Emphasizing driver skill over car set-up was the goal in IROC. Is that the goal of the new package?
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YES. take it out of the engineers hands and put it back in the drivers hands. I think that is what fans want except those who are interested in speed only.
 
I think the bigger thing is we’re trying to find a way to make air be a good thing, not a bad thing. I know we all have different definitions of what makes a great race, and while I did love seeing the low downforce allowing these guys to really get up on that wheel last season, it was very obvious dirty air played a major role
 
Team Penske said:
YES. take it out of the engineers hands and put it back in the drivers hands. I think that is what fans want except those who are interested in speed only.
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That's what fans think they want. Why do you think NASCAR didn't freeze development years ago, and go IROCing? Why is that? Instead of allowing the engineers some freedom in developing unique cars (they find uniqueness anyway because engineers are brilliant....and some cheat (Rodney's Crew)) that awesomely talented drivers need to learn to drive, we try to shove them all in the same box which brings everybody to the same solutions. Hence, massive aero dependency. This grassroots IROCess driver's hands stuff is BS. This sport is about the driver interfacing with the car to become brilliant. There was a reason IROC died. You want anything resembling "stock car" racing? You will have engineers. They develop the cars. You want something else? You will find that at the Chili Bowl.

Last year's racing was fabulous....just nobody wants to admit it.....and this year's will be as well. Engineers will be there the whole time making the cars better, and fans will bitch the whole year because not every race will end in a dead heat.
 
Ventisca said:
They need to harness all the energy used for cheating and it give it one race a year.

Innovator Trophy Unlimited 400

Each team lists their cheating formula — only to be revealed after the race.
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I'm in.
 
It's such BS. The best drivers from the best teams were at Homestead, and a worthy champion was crowned. The season was a freakin' highlight reel. Yet, the bitching is the same every ****** year. I have no idea what the hell some of you are watching. Maybe just stick with the Chili Bowl if that is your bag, and leave Cup for the two of us left in the stands. NASCAR isn't ruining this sport, the ****** fanbase (those who bitch and bail) and ignorant--no ****** stupid--media is. Having said all of that, the new package will be just fine--it will certainly be interesting to me. Can't wait. I am jacked for the test this week. Hoping that NASCAR, and Gluck or whoever chooses to update us because this test will stimulate interest--even if it is complete BS. Get people talking. That's what was forgotten when NASCAR stopped Daytona testing to save billionaires money--tests get people talking, and build momentum.
 
Revman said:
It's such BS. The best drivers from the best teams were at Homestead, and a worthy champion was crowned. The season was a freakin' highlight reel. Yet, the bitching is the same every ******* year. I have no idea what the hell some of you are watching. Maybe just stick with the Chili Bowl if that is your bag, and leave Cup for the two of us left in the stands. NASCAR isn't ruining this sport, the ****** fanbase (those who bitch and bail) and ignorant--no ******* stupid--media is. Having said all of that, the new package will be just fine--it will certainly be interesting to me. Can't wait. I am jacked for the test this week. Hoping that NASCAR, and Gluck or whoever chooses to update us because this test will stimulate interest--even if it is complete BS. Get people talking. That's what was forgotten when NASCAR stopped Daytona testing to save billionaires money--tests get people talking, and build momentum.
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I respectfully disagree about about people on social media and the media ruining things for Nascar. I don't think prospective fans research social media outlets about Nascar and then decide to pass on the series due to bad reviews.
 
gnomesayin said:
While it is complicated, yes, the history I've witnessed in various racing series is not that vastly increasing downforce levels accomplishes the goal of "taking the aero out" of the equation.

That said, I don't think it is accurate to say engines have been capped at a set HP level. Airflow is being restricted with target HP levels in mind. Advancements are still possible.
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Yep...I will always go back to this tweet when talking about reducing HP in the name of cost savings. You want cost savings, hand out spec engines...but this, teams are still building their own stuff and each incremental bit of HP is going to be more and more important than before.

 
IanMcVittie said:
I respectfully disagree about about people on social media and the media ruining things for Nascar. I don't think prospective fans research social media outlets about Nascar and then decide to pass on the series due to bad reviews.
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Would you agree that social media posts influenced by an ignorant media core are reflective of what the current fanbase shares with prospective fans?
 
FLRacingFan said:
Hoping we get something a little more substantial than some 15-second Twitter clips this week. Pretty big test and we should get a much better idea of what the, ahem, package will look like most of the year.
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I heard on Reddit (take it for what it's worth) that NASCAR may stream it. If I were NASCAR, I would give the teams all day to do whatever they wanted to do. Then, I would provide a set of tires for the very last run, and have them dice like hell for 40 laps. I would provide the stream all day, but tweet the hell out of tuning in for the last run. Stimulate some freaking interest. Wouldn't be hard.
 
FLRacingFan said:
Hoping we get something a little more substantial than some 15-second Twitter clips this week. Pretty big test and we should get a much better idea of what the, ahem, package will look like most of the year.
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It depends on if they are all out there at the same time or not, who knows how it will go. I hope they do form up and see how the cars handle in traffic come Thursday. 3 wide for the lead would be nice to see. :D
 
Revman said:
Would you agree that social media posts influenced by an ignorant media core are reflective of what the current fanbase shares with prospective fans?
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Good question but I’m not sure as the only Nascar media I see is what is posted here. I don’t recall any main stream journalist trashing Nascar and the far out stuff I ignore.

I think negative Nascar comments by individuals via social media are done for 2 main reasons. The first come from longtime fans who used to like the series but don’t anymore. The depths to which Nascar has fallen is all the reason they need for teeing off.

The second group just hates what it sees as gimmicks that have made the series unwatchable in many cases. They see Nascar as a foolish group of people that compound stupid choices upon stupid choices. These people feel they have just as much right to express opinion as anyone.
 
StandOnIt said:
It depends on if they are all out there at the same time or not, who knows how it will go. I hope they do form up and see how the cars handle in traffic come Thursday. 3 wide for the lead would be nice to see. :D
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Getting that Talladega experience and all the drama that ensues is what Nascar and a few of the fans here want. Most people here are happy to watch a speed contest put on by skillful drivers. They don’t care about drama or meaningless passes in the pack or for the lead.
 
IanMcVittie said:
Good question but I’m not sure as the only Nascar media I see is what is posted here. I don’t recall any main stream journalist trashing Nascar and the far out stuff I ignore.

I think negative Nascar comments by individuals via social media are done for 2 main reasons. The first come from longtime fans who used to like the series but don’t anymore. The depths to which Nascar has fallen is all the reason they need for teeing off.

The second group just hates what it sees as gimmicks that have made the series unwatchable in many cases. They see Nascar as a foolish group of people that compound stupid choices upon stupid choices. These people feel they have just as much right to express opinion as anyone.
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The concern I have is that NASCAR sees the social media crap as the only voice, and it obviously isn't. The sanctioning body has never been able to get its arms around ingesting the social media significance. In terms of media, I will point to much of what is on NASCAR Radio today as evidence of a group who do not understand the sport. When the producers of that channel then schedule interviews of their own personalities and/or the media group and presents them as experts, it takes the optics of our sport to an embarrassing low.

Dustin Long among others now report on what drivers are tweeting. Really? Here we go again with an overemphasis on the driver drama crap. Why? Because Dustin has no clue about the technical aspects of the sport. He isn't alone. Nate Ryan uses big words to cover up his lack of knowledge instead of interviewing those who do know. Pockrass is a tabloid journalist. It angers me. Study the damn sport, and ask the interesting questions--not the questions you perceive a dwindling fan base to be interested in. Ask questions to get fans interested instead of pacifying those who are marginally invested.
 
Revman said:
The concern I have is that NASCAR sees the social media crap as the only voice, and it obviously isn't. The sanctioning body has never been able to get its arms around ingesting the social media significance. In terms of media, I will point to much of what is on NASCAR Radio today as evidence of a group who do not understand the sport. When the producers of that channel then schedule interviews of their own personalities and/or the media group and presents them as experts, it takes the optics of our sport to an embarrassing low.

Dustin Long among others now report on what drivers are tweeting. Really? Here we go again with an overemphasis on the driver drama crap. Why? Because Dustin has no clue about the technical aspects of the sport. He isn't alone. Nate Ryan uses big words to cover up his lack of knowledge instead of interviewing those who do know. Pockrass is a tabloid journalist. It angers me. Study the damn sport, and ask the interesting questions--not the questions you perceive a dwindling fan base to be interested in. Ask questions to get fans interested instead of pacifying those who are marginally invested.
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Your points make sense. From what you are saying It seems like Nascar and those that cover it are dumbing things down either accidentally or on purpose.
 
Drivers will always drive the sport. Cars don't talk. There has never been a car that was a star, drivers and crew chief's might talk about a car being a star on a "special" show to have something to talk about. These days more than ever, a driver needs to be able to market themselves to sponsors and to the public. I been around racing for a long time. Fans complaining about rules are like the chicken and the egg. Illegal cars came after the first rule was made.
 
Revman said:
Would you agree that social media posts influenced by an ignorant media core are reflective of what the current fanbase shares with prospective fans?
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The question assumes that social media posts are influence by the media. My only media exposure to NASCAR coverage is the NBC and FOX race coverages themselves.

It also assumes the media core is ignorant, a highly debatable point suited to a thread of its own. I don't follow other sources but I'm aware there are several outlets with respected journalists that still cover motorsports, including several on the web who moved there from more traditional media.

What I share with prospective fans is the experience. I offer to take them to a X or Truck race; they drive, I buy the tickets. On the way I introduce them to strategies, terminology, pit crew duties, basic rules, etc. Once we get there, I point out how the track is laid out and what areas to pay special attention to.

EDIT: I wish I'd read your follow-up post before I added this one.
 
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Revman said:
Dustin Long among others now report on what drivers are tweeting. Really? Here we go again with an overemphasis on the driver drama crap. Why?
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Because people have repeated said they want to see more of the drivers' personalities. We've both read comments here that 'Today's drivers ain't got no personality'! Twitter and other social media are how today's drivers can show their personality, with far more relaxation than they can in those pre- and post-race interviews that their sponsors micromanage. I don't know if it's worth covering, but I don't see it going away.
 
I have been a race fan for many years and what has always driven the sport for me is good racing on interesting tracks. I think once a person elevates the players of the game over the game itself problems are created.

If you want to rely on players to drive your sport you better make sure you have someone like Patrick Mahones coming in after Tom Brady.
 
StandOnIt said:
"Boys have at it" came from what Charlie said.;)
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Boys have at it was/is the dumbest thing going. You never allow a player to mete out retribution for what he feels is an unjust occurrence. The league and its agents are the only ones that should be handing out discipline.
 
IanMcVittie said:
Boys have at it was/is the dumbest thing going. You never allow a player to mete out retribution for what he feels is an unjust occurrence. The league and its agents are the only ones that should be handing out discipline.
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and fights and trash talking came after the first flag dropped for the first race. ;) League? agents?
 
IanMcVittie said:
Words spoken off the field of play are not usually a problem. Spearing an opponent or intentionally wrecking a competitor is no bueno everyday of the week
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intentionally wrecking a competitor happens every day in racing, the trick is to not make it look like it. IDK about spearing, is that like axe throwing?
 
IanMcVittie said:
I have been a race fan for many years and what has always driven the sport for me is good racing on interesting tracks. I think once a person elevates the players of the game over the game itself problems are created.

If you want to rely on players to drive your sport you better make sure you have someone like Patrick Mahones coming in after Tom Brady.
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Great post. No, greatest post ever. Nice work....and you had better make sure that Patrick doesn't do anything to screw himself up, or your sport is sunk. Really well said.
 
dpkimmel2001 said:
Can we start complaining about the results today or do we have to wait until Thursday?
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We can’t complain or speculate on what the 2019 rules look like until well into the season is the last I heard. Even if the drivers say they were flat footing it and were running in packs mums the word.
 
They are bringing 5 data cars possibly 7, hard to tell by the article. I thought the original announcement said they were bringing 12 cars to the test?

There will be 21 drivers involved, including 16 Cup drivers and two full-time Xfinity drivers, Noah Gragson and Chase Briscoe. Ross Chastain, David Ragan and Drew Herring each will drive manufacture wheel force cars. Xfinity drivers Zane Smith and Riley Herbst will also be present.
 
StandOnIt said:
Show time

Drivers gear up for important two-day test in Las Vegas

https://nascar.nbcsports.com/2019/01/28/schedule-drivers-set-for-las-vegas-organizational-test/
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Coordinated Team data cars?

"No. 00 – Landon Cassill, Starcom Racing, Chevrolet
No. 1 – Kurt Busch, Chip Ganassi Racing, Chevrolet
No. 2 – Brad Keselowski, Team Penske, Ford
No. 3 – Austin Dillon, Richard Childress Racing, Chevrolet
No. 6 – Ryan Newman, Roush Fenway Racing, Ford
No. 13 – Ty Dillon, Germain Racing, Chevrolet
No. 14 – Clint Bowyer, Stewart-Haas Racing, Ford
No. 18 – Kyle Busch, Joe Gibbs Racing, Toyota
No. 21 – Paul Menard, Wood Brothers Racing, Ford
No. 43 – Bubba Wallace, Richard Petty Motorsports, Chevrolet
No. 47 – Ryan Preece, JTG Racing, Chevrolet
No. 48 – Jimmie Johnson, Hendrick Motorsports, Chevrolet
No. 51 – Cody Ware, Rick Ware Racing, Chevrolet
No. 95 – Matt DiBenedetto, Leavine Family Racing, Toyota

Chevrolet Wheel Force car Ross Chastain, Chevrolet Racing
Ford Wheel Force car David Ragan, Ford Motor Company
Toyota Wheel Force car Drew Herring, Toyota Racing Development

Xfinity Series drivers
No. 8 Zane Smith, JR Motorsports, Chevrolet
No. 9 Noah Gragson, JR Motorsports, Chevrolet
No. 18 Riley Herbst, Joe Gibbs Racing, Toyota
No. 98 Chase Briscoe, Stewart-Haas Racing, Ford"
 
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Ventisca said:
Coordinated Team data cars?

"No. 00 – Landon Cassill, Starcom Racing, Chevrolet
No. 1 – Kurt Busch, Chip Ganassi Racing, Chevrolet
No. 2 – Brad Keselowski, Team Penske, Ford
No. 3 – Austin Dillon, Richard Childress Racing, Chevrolet
No. 6 – Ryan Newman, Roush Fenway Racing, Ford
No. 13 – Ty Dillon, Germain Racing, Chevrolet
No. 14 – Clint Bowyer, Stewart-Haas Racing, Ford
No. 18 – Kyle Busch, Joe Gibbs Racing, Toyota
No. 21 – Paul Menard, Wood Brothers Racing, Ford
No. 43 – Bubba Wallace, Richard Petty Motorsports, Chevrolet
No. 47 – Ryan Preece, JTG Racing, Chevrolet
No. 48 – Jimmie Johnson, Hendrick Motorsports, Chevrolet
No. 51 – Cody Ware, Rick Ware Racing, Chevrolet
No. 95 – Matt DiBenedetto, Leavine Family Racing, Toyota

Chevrolet Wheel Force car Ross Chastain, Chevrolet Racing
Ford Wheel Force car David Ragan, Ford Motor Company
Toyota Wheel Force car Drew Herring, Toyota Racing Development

Xfinity Series drivers
No. 8 Zane Smith, JR Motorsports, Chevrolet
No. 9 Noah Gragson, JR Motorsports, Chevrolet
No. 18 Riley Herbst, Joe Gibbs Racing, Toyota
No. 98 Chase Briscoe, Stewart-Haas Racing, Ford"
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We’ll know how Paul Menard likes the new rules based on his expression alone.
 
Revman said:
I heard on Reddit (take it for what it's worth) that NASCAR may stream it. If I were NASCAR, I would give the teams all day to do whatever they wanted to do. Then, I would provide a set of tires for the very last run, and have them dice like hell for 40 laps. I would provide the stream all day, but tweet the hell out of tuning in for the last run. Stimulate some freaking interest. Wouldn't be hard.
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Good call. :D Not quite all day, but four hours.

https://www.nascar.com/news-media/2019/01/29/las-vegas-test-live-show-nascar-digital/
The best part? NASCAR Digital will host a live show Jan. 31, beginning at 11 a.m. ET, broadcasting the action in Las Vegas, providing instant analysis and talking with drivers in the Neon Garage at the 1.5-mile track.
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https://www.nascar.com/lasvegastest
 
The new package is already working, drawing interest. Some come to look, some will come to scoff, but they will come. ;)
 
StandOnIt said:
The new package is already working, drawing interest. Some come to look, some will come to scoff, but they will come. ;)
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It is working well for those that enjoy pack racing and all the drama and it is drawing attention from those that lament seeing the racing of 2018 gone. To think something like this was brought to fruition due to an ASR. Pity.
 
Nascar is broadcasting this independently of the networks and supplying their own people? This could be a first, I don't remember this happening before.

Visit NASCAR.com on Thursday — https://www.nascar.com/lasvegastest — to watch the action unfold in real time, with reporter Jonathan Merryman and crew chief Chris Rice hosting a four-hour event that will include live updates from Las Vegas with NASCAR.com’s Jessica Ruffin and a live stream of the cars on track.
 
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