Win and You're In; I'm Sold

dpkimmel2001 said:
They've done that this time with this most recent change.

Like I said way back in post #1..... I've never really liked this whole Chase idea since the beginning. I always thought that the best driver over an entire season should be the champion, not over 10, 3 and especially not 1. The way I see it now is that the Chase is here to stay so if I have to live with it, the win and your in works for me. I'm simply not all that excited about the final winner take all.
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If there has to be a chase format it should definitely include all the race winners from the season.

But I will never agree with resetting the points.
 
I like the "win and you're in" format for getting into the Chase, but I'm still a bit skeptical of that system being a part of the Chase itself. It'd be a shame for somebody to win 10 races in a season, be the obvious champion under any other points system, and then blow a tire at Homestead and be screwed. We'll see how it all shakes out.
 
DSquad48 said:
I think the point is that you'll see less and less drivers trying to "settle for points." In the chase, you'd see drivers (at least I know Jimmie did this a lot) settle for a 5th place finish instead of trying to gamble on strategy, push the car to the absolute edge to try to go for a win.
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I don't agree. I think every driver out there has always tried to get the best possible finish every week. If a driver is running 5th he wants to be 4th.
I don't believe the new chase format has changed that.

If anything the new format has the potential to make a driver lazy about getting the best possible finish each race.
What incentive is there now for a driver that has won a race this year to try to finish 4th if he's running 5th near the end of the race?
 
FLRacingFan said:
I've been up 27 hours straight at this point. My reading comprehension is in the gutter.

Ignore that post.
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I'm still not entirely sold the new format, I'm probably gonna need to see an entire season before forming a true opinion. I know the races have been better this year, but I'm not sure that's 100% due to the new format. It's done absolutely nothing for attendance and TV ratings either, so I'm not sure it's accomplishing what Brian France had in mind.
 
So here's a scenario: Reed Sorenson is running toward the rear of the pack this coming weekend at Talladega, on the last lap coming out of 4, the big one happens and wipes out half of the field. Somehow, Sorenson makes it through the melee and gets to the line first.
Next weekend, at Kansas, weather threatens and a late caution comes out. Sorenson is running 28th, last car on the lead lap. Everybody pits and Sorenson stays out. It begins to sprinkle and the race finishes short, under yellow for rain.
Sorenson "earns" his way into The Chase while 32nd in points? I know it's a stretch but it reveals a serious flaw in the new format.
 
BobbyFord said:
So here's a scenario: Reed Sorenson is running toward the rear of the pack this coming weekend at Talladega, on the last lap coming out of 4, the big one happens and wipes out half of the field. Somehow, Sorenson makes it through the melee and gets to the line first.
Next weekend, at Kansas, weather threatens and a late caution comes out. Sorenson is running 28th, last car on the lead lap. Everybody pits and Sorenson stays out. It begins to sprinkle and the race finishes short, under yellow for rain.
Sorenson "earns" his way into The Chase while 32nd in points? I know it's a stretch but it reveals a serious flaw in the new format.
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IF YOU AIN'T FIRST YER LAST BOBBEH ^_^
 
We have 7 different winners in 9 races. 17 races are left in the regular season. Some very capable drivers still don't have a win. To name a few: Johnson, Gordon, Kenseth, Stewart, Kahne, Vickers, Bowyer, Biffle and Hamlin. All of them can win at just about any race. If each of those drivers listed get one win, there would be 16 different winners. There are a number of other drivers that are capable of winning as well. With two more plate tracks in the regular season, throw in some under dogs that can easily steal a win.

I'm going to say there will be at least 14 different winners but I won't be surprised if there are 16 or even more. I like the "Win Your're In" format. Still unsure on the knockout chase stuff thought.
 
BobbyFord said:
So here's a scenario: Reed Sorenson is running toward the rear of the pack this coming weekend at Talladega, on the last lap coming out of 4, the big one happens and wipes out half of the field. Somehow, Sorenson makes it through the melee and gets to the line first.
Next weekend, at Kansas, weather threatens and a late caution comes out. Sorenson is running 28th, last car on the lead lap. Everybody pits and Sorenson stays out. It begins to sprinkle and the race finishes short, under yellow for rain.
Sorenson "earns" his way into The Chase while 32nd in points? I know it's a stretch but it reveals a serious flaw in the new format.
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You have to be in the top 30 lol... and if there are drivers out there in the top 16 in points with no wins that don't make it because Sorenson has 2 wins well then too bad so sad... why should those guys be given a chase spot over someone who won twice? What because they got more top 5's in the year... please.. the format is win and ur in... not get some top 5's and sit 16th with no wins and cry because someone else lucked into a win and u didn't make the chase.
 
BobbyFord said:
My point is that you can make the Chase without "racing" your way in and IMO that is a flaw in the format.
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Who cares... its not like Reed Sorenson is going to win the championship.

Also that's not even true... winning a race .. no matter how... is "racing your way in"... lol
 
BobbyFord said:
So here's a scenario: Reed Sorenson is running toward the rear of the pack this coming weekend at Talladega, on the last lap coming out of 4, the big one happens and wipes out half of the field. Somehow, Sorenson makes it through the melee and gets to the line first.
Next weekend, at Kansas, weather threatens and a late caution comes out. Sorenson is running 28th, last car on the lead lap. Everybody pits and Sorenson stays out. It begins to sprinkle and the race finishes short, under yellow for rain.
Sorenson "earns" his way into The Chase while 32nd in points? I know it's a stretch but it reveals a serious flaw in the new format.
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Although I like where this post is headed, it's flawed. The first suggestion is more likely to happen than the latter. If rain in the area is that eminent, the leaders aint gonna come in. Teams have an eye on the radar at all times if rain is threatening.

I'm still waiting for a driver who barely doesnt make the chase to dominate the final 10 races just so I can laugh at NASCAR's idiocy of thinking anyone from 17th on back cant make a run for the championship in the final 10 races.
 
BobbyFord said:
So here's a scenario: Reed Sorenson is running toward the rear of the pack this coming weekend at Talladega, on the last lap coming out of 4, the big one happens and wipes out half of the field. Somehow, Sorenson makes it through the melee and gets to the line first.
Next weekend, at Kansas, weather threatens and a late caution comes out. Sorenson is running 28th, last car on the lead lap. Everybody pits and Sorenson stays out. It begins to sprinkle and the race finishes short, under yellow for rain.
Sorenson "earns" his way into The Chase while 32nd in points? I know it's a stretch but it reveals a serious flaw in the new format.
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Here's another scenario that, although unlikely, is possible:

Jeff Gordon continues to run well, but for whatever reason doesn't score a win in the first 26 races and is 2nd in points after Richmond. In addition, there managed to be 16 different winners in the first 26 races. So, just because Gordon couldn't get a win, he would be relegated to no better than a 17th place points finish despite the fact that it would have been a championship type season in any previous year. Doesn't really seem fair.

Once again, highly unlikely, but not totally impossible.
 
SlicedBread22 said:
Who cares... its not like Reed Sorenson is going to win the championship.
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Who cares? The fans. If Reed were to make the chase off of some BS win, he'd be taking the place of another driver could potentially be competitive for a championship. That's ridiculous. Thats why I think even a driver like Harvick who has 2 wins but sits 20th in points shouldnt make the chase if he doesnt advance position. Sure, he had a good enough car to win 2/26 races... but his season has been total **** otherwise. That's not championship caliber.
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ToyYoda said:
Here's another scenario that, although unlikely, is possible:

Jeff Gordon continues to run well, but for whatever reason doesn't score a win in the first 26 races and is 2nd in points after Richmond. In addition, there managed to be 16 different winners in the first 26 races. So, just because Gordon couldn't get a win, he would be relegated to no better than a 17th place points finish despite the fact that it would have been a championship type season in any previous year. Doesn't really seem fair.

Once again, highly unlikely, but not totally impossible.
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Exactly, say Gordon is 2nd in points after Richmond with 0 wins and Harvick sits 17th in points with 2 or more wins. He fills Gordon's spot. :bsflag:
 
ChexOrWrex said:
Although I like where this post is headed, it's flawed. The first suggestion is more likely to happen than the latter. If rain in the area is that eminent, the leaders aint gonna come in. Teams have an eye on the radar at all times if rain is threatening.

I'm still waiting for a driver who barely doesnt make the chase to dominate the final 10 races just so I can laugh at NASCAR's idiocy of thinking anyone from 17th on back cant make a run for the championship in the final 10 races.
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See 2011
 
ChexOrWrex said:
Who cares? The fans. If Reed were to make the chase off of some BS win, he'd be taking the place of another driver could potentially be competitive for a championship. That's ridiculous. Thats why I think even a driver like Harvick who has 2 wins but sits 20th in points shouldnt make the chase if he doesnt advance position. Sure, he had a good enough car to win 2/26 races... but his season has been total **** otherwise. That's not championship caliber.
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Man... if someone who "has a shot" hasn't won by the time the chase starts... then they probably wont have a shot lol.. sorry but if u cant beat the field even one week in the regular season u absolutely DO NOT deserve to win the championship.

ChexOrWrex said:
Exactly, say Gordon is 2nd in points after Richmond with 0 wins and Harvick sits 17th in points with 2 or more wins. He fills Gordon's spot.
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Nope... sucks to be Gordon, should have done better. They all have the same rules. If you're not good enough to fill the requirements to make the chase then u don't make the chase... simple.
 
still a big fan of:
--- " win-n-ur in "
---chase 16...12...8..4... 1 = champ format.
---'14 car rules
---goodyear '14 tires

if ambrose gets rc win....an underdog gets rp win.....we get 16 winners after 1st 26.
 
SlicedBread22 said:
Nope... sucks to be Gordon, should have done better. They all have the same rules. If you're not good enough to fill the requirements to make the chase then u don't make the chase... simple.
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:confused: Your attempted attacks are getting asinine. It was about Reed, or another low-class team, making the chase off of a bs win while another driver who has performed well enough to have had made the chase off of top 5s and 10s doesnt because of Reed's one win and piss-poor season. I'd rather have this convo with a fan who has been around to watch nascar before the chase and not some new kid on the block who doesnt know dick**** about a nascar season.
 
So I actually like the "Win and Your In" thing. it has obviously produced some very exciting races. However, I'd also contribute that to the new aero package that NASCAR has put out at the beginning of this year (The Zero Ride Height rule). Still kinda miffed that Johnson has yet to win one race, but I have a feeling that his time will come. However, I am still not sold on the eliminations, especially the winner takes all race at Homestead.
 
mreed said:
We all know the difference. But you really didn't make it clear you were talking about a "bump and run" after the block.
A blocking car can be moved during the block very easily if the car getting blocked holds his line and stays in the gas, which by the way is not "hooking".

Surely you know the difference between hooking a car and holding your line.
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Now you're saying 'moved' rather than 'spun'.

My work here is done. :D
 
BobbyFord said:
I'll make a bet right now that this format, in it's present form, is not here in 2105.
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The drivers love it, and the fans seem to love the racing they are seeing. There could be some tweeking, if that's what you mean, but I think pure points racing formats are dead for good.
 
mreed said:
If talking in circles is your work here, then job well done.
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How else can I keep up with you? You change what I said, then imagine I said things I didn't, and try to start an argument about it. o_O

Some hobby you have there. I hope it works out better for you next time. :p
 
FenderBumper said:
How else can I keep up with you? You change what I said, then imagine I said things I didn't, and try to start an argument about it. o_O

Some hobby you have there. I hope it works out better for you next time. :p
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Yes, because if someone doesn't agree with something you say they are obviously trying to start an argument. :rolleyes:
Sorry I misunderstood what you were trying to say. I should have somehow known you meant bump and run when you talked about drivers getting moved for blocking. :confused:
 
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ChexOrWrex said:
It was about Reed, or another low-class team, making the chase off of a bs win while another driver who has performed well enough to have had made the chase off of top 5s and 10s doesnt because of Reed's one win and piss-poor season. I'd rather have this convo with a fan who has been around to watch nascar before the chase and not some new kid on the block who doesnt know dick**** about a nascar season.
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LMAO
ChexOrWrex said:
Exactly, say Gordon is 2nd in points after Richmond with 0 wins and Harvick sits 17th in points with 2 or more wins. He fills Gordon's spot
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That's about Reed?o_O

Regardless of if Ive seen a season before the chase I seem to be one of the only ones around here who just tells it like it is right now. See the problem with you guys that have been watching for that long is that you think for some reason that it matters what you think about the chase or what you want a champion to have to do in a season.

The fact is that if "Gordon is 2nd in points after Richmond with 0 wins and Harvick sits 17th with 2 or more".. he does get that spot, because that's how you get into the chase now. Gordon knows it as much as Harvick does and whether you or anyone likes it or not doesn't change the fact. If Jeff beats the field even once in 26 races he wouldn't have to worry about that. Being second in points with 0 wins means nothing anymore, deal with it.

Like I said, any driver that can't beat everyone for even one race in the regular season doesn't deserve the championship anyway. Even if they finish 2nd 26 times. That's my opinion.. and just so happens that's how it works.
 
SlicedBread22 said:
Regardless of if Ive seen a season before the chase I seem to be one of the only ones around here who just tells it like it is right now. See the problem with you guys that have been watching for that long is that you think for some reason that it matters what you think about the chase or what you want a champion to have to do in a season.
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SlicedBread22 said:
The fact is that if "Gordon is 2nd in points after Richmond with 0 wins and Harvick sits 17th with 2 or more".. he does get that spot, because that's how you get into the chase now. Gordon knows it as much as Harvick does and whether you or anyone likes it or not doesn't change the fact. If Jeff beats the field even once in 26 races he wouldn't have to worry about that. Being second in points with 0 wins means nothing anymore, deal with it.

Like I said, any driver that can't beat everyone for even one race in the regular season doesn't deserve the championship anyway. Even if they finish 2nd 26 times. That's my opinion.. and just so happens that's how it works.
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We all know how it works. :confused: The ones who have seen the changes nascar has made over the past 15 years are just pointing out how this system may fail to crown a champion who did not have the best overall season.
 
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