Discussion in 'NASCAR chat' started by FLRacingFan, Oct 2, 2018.
The new spoiler is like porn for Rodney. He can't stop looking....dreaming.
This was a paid commercial for Nascar racing. Lets get the hype going
off season Bud. Klingerman and his X factor. He's been busy
I like this #2 guy. Lifetime racing fan
Phelps is juggling several things at the same time.
For instance, NASCAR is going to a new competition package for tracks longer than 1.5 miles in length, excluding Daytona and Talladega, which will knock the horsepower of these mighty V-8 engines from 750 horsepower down to 550.
Next year’s Cup Series cars will be built so they are not like arrows being shot from a bow. The 2019 cars will feature a larger rear spoiler and air ducts in the front bumper designed to create turbulence.
A similar package was used in this year’s All-Star Race, where the horsepower was knocked all the way back to 400 horsepower.
The engine/aero package is designed to tighten competition through the field from track to track.
Races at tracks measured at 1-mile or shorter and road courses will get all 750 horses under the hood.
“The package is loosely based on the package we used at this year’s All-Star Race,” he said. “Our research, from a fan’s satisfaction standpoint, was the single-highest race we had all year.
“It was great to watch. Will every race next year be as good as the All-Star Race? Probably not. With that said, we saw some great racing in 2018 in all three (national) series.”
By modifying the All-Star package, NASCAR’s competition department thinks they have “found the sweet spot” which will promote “more side-by-side racing” in 2019.
“That’s what our fans want,” Phelps said. “We want to give them more of what they want. This isn’t pack racing. The only place we will see pack racing is Daytona and Talladega.”
“You won’t see a guy jump out to a 7- or 8-second lead after the first few laps,” he added. “This package will keep people more in close contact. We think it will be compelling for fans.”
After shooting up the corporate ladder, Phelps said he feels comfortable as NASCAR’s out-front executive.
“The fact that Jim and Lesa (France Kennedy, NASCAR vice-chair) put me in this position is incredibly humbling,” he said. “I love it. I’m a lifetime NASCAR fan. I went to my first race when I was 5 years old.
“It’s a sport I love. If there’s something I can do in the seat I’m in that helps this sport get better and grow, that’s something I will clearly want to do.”
I been on this forum for 3 years now.. and I have seen you guys complain over the dumbest stuff in here wheh it comes to NASCAR. Like how many people in the stands, the cost of a race which is dirt cheap. stages being to long or to short. Bringing back these old tracks that you know won’t ever come back. Hotel prices when NASCAR has nothing to do with that lol. Bubba Wallace wearing his firesuit unzipped like other drivers but saying he needs to pull his pants up lol.. I mean I can go on for years about the dumb complaints .. But for 2019 they change to this dumb rule package they used for ALL STAR race and nobody saying anything smh.. the cars will have even more downforce with the spoiler high as the Statue of Liberty the cars still dragging the ground and with these air ducks haha .. these cars already almost drive themselves with all the downforce and stuck to the ground and now you taking away around 200 HP this is a joke and I can’t believe y’all on board for this but get mad about other dumb stuff that goes on with NASCAR. I come to love the sport over the last 3 years and have spent a lot of money supporting it and trying to get friends and family to tune in .. but this rules package is just dumb and will be terrible.. I’m not tuning in every week besides short tracks to see cars sling shot pass other cars.. I was at the ALL STAR race and that’s the only way you could pass . You had to wait for another car to get a run and block that car and get there momentum to pass another car.. it will really be out the drivers hands this year. The driver will make the 3% difference and that’s SAD. TAKE CARE I’m checking out! Y’all have fun.
It's a NASCAR forum. Fans complain. That's what we do. Heck, that's what you're doing. Looks like you're one of us now.
Good thread on this same subject here ==> https://racing-forums.com/threads/nascar-announces-2019-mencs-rules.65527/
Did you not read my post? Yes I know I’m complaining.
If it flames out NASCAR will have no choice but to go backwards here. They'll hear the fan base and they'll certainly also hear the drivers. I honestly believe this package is nothing more than a band-aid for the gen 6 car until the gen 7 is ready. We can only hope anyways. I'm going to head to Atlanta to give it a chance and see how it races on a 1.5 even though I have low hopes.
I agree 100% on reducing hp though. It doesn't appear that we're ever going back to high hp NASCAR and that's a real shame.
Good points! Can I ask you a question? Why do you agree on the HP change but then say it’s a shame you think NASCAR is done with the high HP? What exactly does reducing the HP by almost have do? I loved thinking that these cars was MONSTERS when I was at the track or told friends and family about them. The rumble the sound and just knowing what these MONSTERS had under the hood. Now it’s just like oh it’s a cup car
Nobody will ever convince me that the Cup cars having nearly 900 HP made the racing any better than when they had 650 horsepower. All that HP and the specialty one-off race only engines needed to make those numbers feasible just served to make the cars that much less relevant to the manufacturers and the buying public. The best racing I ever saw was produced by 274 CID V6 engines and crate 400+ horsepower production V8s in the old ASA series. The myth that more horsepower creates a better show is for the most part just that. A myth.
Nah I was saying I agree with your displeasure of reducing the hp. Sorry I probably should've added the "with you" in there lol.
I will say as an iracing guy daily more HP makes it much harder to drive. You’ve gotta be dialed the **** in as more HP = more touchy.
With that being said I do approve of the changes, however I do hope downforce is removed a bit. Say what you will but INDYCAR is not easy to drive and it’s low HP and very high downforce on ovals. Most of all INDYCAR oval racing is typically very exciting, yet NASCAR at times can lack some serious action making it so track dependent
I think it's more along the lines of what @Thegeneral23 said. I posted this earlier in this thread somewhere but I saw this elsewhere and it puts it pretty clearly, for me anyways...
"Cup cars should be monstrous powerhouses that demand respect. Idling around most tracks with a half-dead engine and a million pounds of downforce is just wrong on principle."
And even they are going back to 900hp engines in a couple years I think
If they go back to production based engines, they WOULDN'T be half dead, they would be REAL engines at their peak output. Also, I don't give a damn whether we have 10,000 pounds of downforce or 10 pounds downforce, I want to see a good show, and what I saw from the low downforce package, which I wholeheartedly approved of when they did it was a HUGE disappointment to me. I know some of you love what you saw last year, but I have been watching this stuff religiously since 1981, and I have seldom been more bored or dissatisfied with the on track product. The TV ratings and attendance would seem to indicate that there are many others that share that point of view.
See you understand where I’m coming from.. if anyone could dunk a basketball basketball players wouldn’t be so special or if everyond could run a 40 yard dash in a 4.2 the people that do wouldn’t be special.. what I’m saying these car are suppose to be MONSTERS and just seem like you should be scared to death to get behind a wheel of one them. That’s the trill of nascar to me.. knowing that damn car out there is a BEAST!!!
Seem to be missing about this sport is that it’s no damn personality in it! Only person that has it is Kyle Busch! Without Kyle damn Busch the sport would really lack any damn personality at all.. he is the only one that stands up for himself and don’t care what he says and he a big dog sponsor!! That’s why I love him.. y’all need to be thanken him for what he brings to the sport.. .. the sport just needs a complete makeover..I could say a interview for each driver after a race besides Kevin Harvick and Kyle Busch and that’s sad. It’s the same thing every Sunday lol..word for word.. oh I’ll text him it’s no big deal .. man nobody wants to hear that!!! Show some emotion don’t talk to the guy don’t sit beside him in the tent before y’all come out let’s get some damn emotion in it..
I honestly don't think it's going to change the ratings or attendance either way but we'll have to wait and see. I think we got what we got in those areas.
As far as the hp argument goes, there's no denying that the high hp requires the drivers to tiptoe around the throttle more. With the car control ability these guys posses, I think they'll be able hammer down a 500hp engine on corner exit with little to no trouble at all, especially with high downforce. It may not add to the quality of the racing, but it does add to the spectator experience in terms of sound, and it makes me feel better knowing that while maybe the cars aren't impossible to drive, they're at least having to work some inside of them.
A change in tire philosophy alone would probably make 550 HP high downforce cars drive as difficult as 900HP low downforce ones. There is also the fact that if you are running side by side with people all of the time it is more challenging to drive than having cars strung out with a 100 yards between them. You may be right about the attendance or ratings, but the mass exodus we saw just this last year indicates to me that perhaps people were particularly turned off by what they saw last year. That's the feedback I get from the less rabid NASCAR fans I personally know. A good example was Indy. Because of the rainout, may dad, my buddy and I got to see both races in person back to back. The three of us unanimously agreed that the Xfinity race was vastly more entertaining than the Cup race, and I thought the Cup race was far from the worst Brickyard I have ever seen.
i agree and when you see what people have posted about the old days, unknowingly
they do also. The 90's was some good racing with the twisted sister and a top 650 HP engine.
Today's engines don't get used except for a brief moment on the straightaway.
I don't like the choked engine idea. I would rather see the old engines with max throttle response.
You're right, the sport DOES need personality, but most of us would say that Kyle Busch personality is NOT what we are looking for. Some people have cocky swagger and can pull it off, and some people just come off as petulant jerks. True or not, the latter is how Kyle comes off to people that don't love him, and that doesn't really sell.
I agree we don't need choked down engines. That's why we need production based engines that would be screaming out at full song making 500-600HP instead of racing engines that could easily make 1100-1200 HP making 500-600HP.
It does fly in the face of those who think the cars of today are right on the edge of control when they show the in car camera shot and the driver looks to be sitting in a car on a Sunday drive when films of back in the day show Yarbourgh and others sawing at the wheel driving cars that were genuinely on the edge of control, not these science projects they race now. The faster they go the more downforce they produce, and the so called "edge" of out of control is easily predictable. The only complaints come from the drivers when one of them gets too close to the other and one of them becomes "unstuck" from the racetrack. Hopefully the packages will eliminate a lot of that so they can race side by side and actually be able to pass one another at will.
I don't know where you got that bit about nobody saying anything. Half this place is ready to storm the Daytona offices with pitchforks and burning torches.
It's closely related to that other fairy tale, that faster racing is better racing.
There's today's problem - power steering. Take that out and we'll put wheel-sawing back, and strengthen the 'drivers are athletes' argument to boot!
('Strengthen', 'athlete'; see what I did there? )
I don't care about the horsepower numbers. I don't care about the downforce numbers. All I care is that they are not wide open all the way around the track, and there is no pack racing. 4 times a year of that makes it special and is enough. Make the drivers drive, not survive. The number of races where both of those things will exist will go up by at least double next season.
400 horsepower ASA stock cars produced great racing because ASA was a short track series. The 90s NASCAR was great racing because the cars didn't handle as well, and they were only at 125-130 in the middle of the corner on the mile and a halfs. Not just because they had lower horsepower. No splitter, no giant spoiler and very low corner speeds meant that air played way less of a part. No coincidence, today's best races are at tracks where air plays no part.
no giant spoiler..wa, huh? look at the droop of that hood will ya, ya think they were getting any downforce out of that?
Still not the size of the current spoiler, and again I said I don't care about downforce numbers, I care about the driver making more difference.
With all due respect sir, anyone that was bored with last season, has been bored to death for the past decade.
Down force was on the rear tires only for a little giddyupgo.
Front end was free to lift off the track at any time and nothing stopped the air from going under the car.
This year he will offset the car instead of the spoiler .......... nobody will notice for at least 2 years.
Genius! ....and now he will go with a legal spoiler and an illegal car! They will be focused on the spoiler, and not even see the blower....which, of course, would have no performance advantage anyway.
I Youtubed the 400hp all-star race again. Very Daytona and Xfinity-esque, at least that's what it reminds me of, being that aero dependent, and the tandem push on restarts, 3 wide. I can see what some may like about it, sort of a hybrid plate track, forces a lot of side by side and aggressive moves, attempts to solve the cookie cutter problem, and keeps a lot of cars hanging around out front in the draft. If you love watching the plate tracks, you'll probably love it.
Not exactly my preference, since I like horsepower and this removes some technical aspects for the drivers. I genuinely enjoy the leader kicking the crap out of everyone, putting legitimate cars a lap down, and true time gaps that aren't someone piggy backing off your wake.
I would be worried about long runs. Some of the most boring races have been aero dependent races on the 1.5, so if this does get spread out and there's no passing because of the air, it is going to get real boring real quick with that much downforce flat flooted.
Regardless, I am willing to give it a whirl and see. Even if I wasn't, I would, just to see the train wreck post Brian
I really have never agreed with the flat footing or the choking down part that some fear. AND I'll tell ya why, I can't believe teams will only have the added 100 HP figure Nascar says about added HP and I can't believe anybody that has been around for a while believes that either. Engine builders don't think that way or they are fired and somebody steps up than can get a whole lot more HP out of the engine. And another thing on the slippery side. Teams have had hours and hours of simulations and wind tunnel testing this off season they didn't have when they tested this last summer. Ya really think the cars that they were testing this summer (Johnson was driving a mule car for Goodyear) or raced in the All Star race are going to be the full race trim version months later when it comes time to put them out on the track?
You're right, we'll be getting an even more unknown version. That's sort of even worse though, since the sales pitch was that fan feedback at the all star race was amazing. We'll have to wait and see what the horsepower bump does.
They simply offset the car from the spoiler ... and yes, there is no performance advantage. Rodney likes living the stressful life
Rodney spots the rest of the field a couple of races. It keeps it interesting for him. without the little purple bouncy thing
So skew becomes legal again as well. You don't move the body. You move the wheels. Genius! Just like Delana's wife, I don't want Rodney to stop trying. Would be such a boring sport. BIG FAN OF THE PURPLE BOUNCY THING
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