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NASCAR considering radical changes to playoff system

ToyYoda

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Yep.

Robin Pemberton, NASCAR’s vice president of competition, was as loose as I have ever seen, tossing brickbats at fellow officials and journalists alike.

Some of the more important explanations included the claim that the new Chase points system was more than three years in the making. Bonus points after Richmond count only in the first round of the Chase. Thereafter, pre-Chase bonus points will not be counted after each of the final resets.

Awarding more points to winners, as I would like, was considered and discarded because it might create a runaway situation. In other words, NASCAR didn’t want the Sprint Cup title to be clinched at any point before the series finale at Homestead-Miami Speedway.
So in other words, NASCAR wants wins to mean more and mean less at the same time...

I think a bunch of zoo monkeys flinging poop at each other could have come up with a better format than this.
 

SlicedBread22

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So in other words, NASCAR wants wins to mean more and mean less at the same time...

I think a bunch of zoo monkeys flinging poop at each other could have come up with a better format than this.
I don't follow.. how does not making them worth more points make them less important?
 

ToyYoda

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I don't follow.. how does not making them worth more points make them less important?
By making the bonus points for wins only good for the first three races. The points reset at the beginning of every round is one of the worst aspects of this format. If they're gonna reset, it should only be done after Richmond and again after Phoenix. The rest is just to bunch everybody up and create artificial drama.
 

SlicedBread22

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By making the bonus points for wins only good for the first three races. The points reset at the beginning of every round is one of the worst aspects of this format. If they're gonna reset, it should only be done after Richmond and again after Phoenix. The rest is just to bunch everybody up and create artificial drama.
Yeah but after that point the winners are guaranteed entry to the next round.. I'd say it's more important than ever at that point.
 

ToyYoda

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Yeah but after that point the winners are guaranteed entry to the next round.. I'd say it's more important than ever at that point.
Yeah, the Chase wins are magnified, but the wins from the first 26 are kind of thrown out the window come race #4 of the Chase. The fact that the points leader and the 12th place driver are reset to the same number of points at race #4 kinda sucks too.
 

StandOnIt

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Yeah, the Chase wins are magnified, but the wins from the first 26 are kind of thrown out the window come race #4 of the Chase. The fact that the points leader and the 12th place driver are reset to the same number of points at race #4 kinda sucks too.
Yeah, and how fair is that to the driver who has a much better record..they are creating an underdog for their dog and pony show and we are supposed to buy into it. They have forgotten that most fans are one driver fans, and the only possible reason to keep watching after their driver is gone is if they don't want some other driver they don't like to win. None of the drivers will be able to say anything negative except Dale Jr. hell, next they will be docking race points for speaking out.
 

FenderBumper

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The whole thing is gimmicky, just like every other playoff system.

Championship be damned. If the racing is better, I don't care.
 

FLRacingFan

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The whole thing is gimmicky, just like every other playoff system.
Championship be damned. If the racing is better, I don't care.
Some sports need playoffs for competitive reasons. The Patriots play the Giants only once in every four years. Jeff Gordon races against Carl Edwards every week.

If they want to make the racing better they should try checking out the tires that can go 212 laps on one run.
 

dirtguru

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If they want racing to be more exciting, add speed bumps. If they want the points to be determined by team effort, leave it up to the teams. I know they would like every race to draw the publicity, attention, and excitement that races like the Sprint All Star Race draw but I just don't see that happening.
 

FenderBumper

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Some sports need playoffs for competitive reasons. The Patriots play the Giants only once in every four years. Jeff Gordon races against Carl Edwards every week.

If they want to make the racing better they should try checking out the tires that can go 212 laps on one run.
Yep. I was recently posted that a playoff without multiple divisions doesn't make sense, and never will.

Tires should be designed to last 2 fuel runs, but only be fast for half a run.
 

hawg dawg

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read another "what-if" this weekend.
race past 1/2 way.
most all pit....cept dana....who stays out as leader.
boom...rain comes .... race red flagged....eventually called....dana wins !
in chase now ! ha!
 

StandOnIt

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that's all it takes for any of them..they blow up early in the chase, they can come back and win.
This is from the Racer.com Robin Miller's mailbag
Someone in last week's Mailbag was talking about advertising. I know the budget is limited – er… non-existent – but they really could capitalize on this. NASCAR just alienated a fair chunk of true racing fans who appreciate that winning championships is really about consistency, speed, and winning races. Scenario for the "Chase Grid": win one race in the first 26. Coast and work on setups all year for the Grid; while finishing the season points in a lowly 28th. Finish in the top 35 percent of all Chase competitors in the first nine races so you are Top 4 going into Homestead (fourth, actually, and 100 points back). Win the race, and you are the winner. Great season and a true champion...NOT!
 

hawg dawg

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miller has never written anything .....w/o complainin ! ha! sorta his mo. like -n- followed him for yrs.
he shoulda also listed odds a' that happenin tho.

but assume he's not leaving......will still be reporter again in '14 ?
 

StandOnIt

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amazing how I could figure out what you would say before ya said it. IMO he has a valid point, it has been discussed here for many pages. Joey's crew chief was all excited about it, he could blow up like last year and still win the championship for example. Kingsettes, and do overs.
 

hawg dawg

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got me on kingsettes ???

yeah---i read all 38 pages .
just thought ya'll could use 1 more "what if " w/ danica !
think joey's been covered ! ha!
 
M

Mopardh9

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The whole thing is gimmicky, just like every other playoff system.

Championship be damned. If the racing is better, I don't care.
Do you really think the racing will be better? The only way ther racing gets better is if the cars are better. Gimmicks are just that....gimmicks, they will soon wear off like most gimmicks and be forgotten.
 

FLRacingFan

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Yep. I was recently posted that a playoff without multiple divisions doesn't make sense, and never will.

Tires should be designed to last 2 fuel runs, but only be fast for half a run.
If they had to have a four-driver playoff I'd like to see it be the points leader after each eight-race segment with the reset with the four segment winners coming before the 33rd race, and the driver with the most points in those final four races wins the title.

I agree, give them some durability but not so much that lap times barely fall off over the course of a run. When I heard Gil Martin talk about that after Phoenix I was shocked.
 

FenderBumper

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If they had to have a four-driver playoff I'd like to see it be the points leader after each eight-race segment with the reset with the four segment winners coming before the 33rd race, and the driver with the most points in those final four races wins the title.

I agree, give them some durability but not so much that lap times barely fall off over the course of a run. When I heard Gil Martin talk about that after Phoenix I was shocked.


The tire situation is pretty technical. Goodyear talked about the challenge the heavy and faster car presents. Heavier and faster means you need thicker sidewalls. Thicker sidewalls hold the heat and melt the tire surface. The only solution is a harder compound that doesn't melt, and those compounds don't wear out much.

As I've been saying on here for years, they need a larger tire to dissipate that heat and allow for a softer, racier compound that wears. It's that, or slow the cars down. The easiest way to do that, and solve some of the aero push issues, is go back to a valance and lower the rear deck.
 

FenderBumper

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Do you really think the racing will be better? The only way ther racing gets better is if the cars are better. Gimmicks are just that....gimmicks, they will soon wear off like most gimmicks and be forgotten.
Not really, but they did make some minor changes to the car this year. I was at the Charlotte test and there was some racing and passing going on in the middle of the run. Still not enough changes, IMO.

This can't be fixed with point gimmicks. nascar needs to fix the cars, but they seem to think that cars running close means it's all good. Meanwhile, they are jamming up because of aero push. If nascar really wants to compete with stick and ball in the fall, why is the biggest race of the year run in February?
 

Matthew2470

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After watching NASCAR Now and hearing how excited the experts are about the new format, I am really looking forward to seeing how everything unfolds. Elimination races are exciting and we'll get to see several.
 

ChexOrWrex

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Comes down to whoever beats the others wins the up... they STILL all have the exact same opportunity..
Eh. Say JJ wins the Daytona 500, he has all season to experiment for the chase. Jeff Gordon wins at Richmond & he's in the chase but has had no time to prepare like Jimmie has. That is the problem with the win & you're in aspect
 
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Kyle18fan

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After watching NASCAR Now and hearing how excited the experts are about the new format, I am really looking forward to seeing how everything unfolds. Elimination races are exciting and we'll get to see several.
Its all fun and games until our favorite gets booted :(
 

SlicedBread22

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Eh. Say JJ wins the Daytona 500, he has all season to experiment for the chase. Jeff Gordon wins at Richmond & he's in the chase but has had no time to prepare like Jimmie has. That is the problem with the win & you're in aspect
I know.. I get it... and it could really suck.. but I don't think that will happen.. first of all the guy who ends up winning the cup most likely couldn't run 25th every week if he tried.. because chances are they'll have some fast cars.. and like I said, everyone is givin the same chance.. if someone happens to find a way to take advantage of it.. kudos to them... for doing it before the next guy... and if Jeff wanted to prepare like Jimmie was able to... he should have won earlier... they both.. all of them.. have the same shot... and one will win, and that's what will make them a champion.
 

Johali

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I just figured out that no matter who wins the championship they will be crucified on here by the "I told you so's" that "prove" how they manipulated the system.
 
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Kyle18fan

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I just figured out that no matter who wins the championship they will be crucified on here by the "I told you so's" that "prove" how they manipulated the system.
The eventual champion will mean less to me than ever, I will form an opinion of who I think the champion REALLY is at the end of the season like I always do. I will inform you of my decision :)
 

SlicedBread22

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..... did people on here say JJ didn't deserve the 2012 All Star win? Because he manipulated the **** out of that one... but won it fair and square... just like the champion this year will have.
 

dpkimmel2001

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It is kind of fun to watch many of the newer NASCAR fans bearing witness to this format change. I went through the same thing with the change to the Chase format. I've still never really accepted it and have looked at all subsequent champions differently that pre-Chase champions. There's simply no comparison IMO. The same thing will now be said between the last format of the Chase and the new one. No comparison.

All that being said let's get this season under way. I'm ready to sit back and enjoy it.
 
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Mopardh9

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This is the way I'm going to judge the season, and that is by quality of racing in the first 26 races. If the racing is better, then I'll say that I'm happy about what Nascar did with the cars. As far as the point sustem goes, that is a farce, I don't really care who wins it because IMO it doesn't mean nearly half of what it should mean. And to let all you guys on here know I will be complaining like hell if Daytona is follow the leader for 150 laps!
 
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