Silly Season 2020

LewTheShoe said:
My complaint about Toyota is how they have spiraled upward the cost of an OEM even being in Nascar racing... because that just hastens the time Chevy and/or Ford decide to withdraw. As @Revman loves to remind us, Toyota has redefined the business model of an OEM in Nascar by the factory assuming various key functions that were previously team responsibilities.

For example, The Athletic reports that Toyota has spent at least $23 million over four years to develop Christopher Bell as a driver, not including the millions more spent on other Toyota development drivers. Driver development has always been a team activity before Toyota. Or another example... Toyota's factory-owned turnkey engine shop, which TRD-supported teams are required to use, a sharp contrast to Chevy and Ford practices.

My bottom line conclusion: it has become what Jack Roush said it would become. No bueno, IMO.
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But if it is allowed by NASCAR and is more effective than the competition -- it is Evolutionary and competitors are at risk as is the nature of competition; unless it reaches a point of such financial or performance disadvantage that NASCAR intervenes or the sport is so irreparably harmed that it ceases to exist.
 
wi_racefan said:
The problem with Bell's stats are is it the car or the driver? Let's face it JGR equipment and support in the Xfinity series is I feel significantly better than everyone else.

Look are Jone's stats in the Xfinity series and now see what he's done in cup?


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That's a legitimate question. The 20 Xfinity car is stout. Jones stats were very good in it, but Bell's are on another planet on consistency and win totals in back to back seasons.

I think Jones is pretty dang good anyhow for year 3 in Cup. Win at Darlington. Almost no rookie in Cup wins right away anymore, so I don't expect that.
 
Formerjackman said:
Well who's fault was it that it's second tier equipment, and why is it suddenly going to be considerably better equipment once Bell slides into the seat? I agree 100% that quantity doesn't equal quality, but in this case, they could have had BOTH. Truthfully, I'm glad Matt will NOT be driving a Toyota next year, I'm only trying to make sense of this from a business and competition standpoint.
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Try this idea. Matt drove for a team that had support the from Toyota and JGR and did quite well.
NOW Bell will drive for the same team that as Matt but he will be driving a JGR prepared car very much like the drivers for WB drive a Penske car.
You can be sure both JGR and Toyota will be increasing their financial support to make sure Bell is a happy driver in their fold. Having 5 drivers that are all capable of winning is much better than Chev having 12 drivers with little chance of a win.
 
LewTheShoe said:
TRD-supported teams are required to use, a sharp contrast to Chevy and Ford practices.
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Really? Hendrick motor shop and Roush-Yates are other ways of saying "TRD". Ya wanna write a check, or spend the money? What difference does it make? None.

"For example, The Athletic reports that Toyota has spent at least $23 million over four years to develop Christopher Bell as a driver, not including the millions more spent on other Toyota development drivers. Driver development has always been a team activity before Toyota."

I will give you that....Driver Development was not an original value of TRD. In fact, Lee White hated the idea. However, Toyota won't keep all of the drivers, and they know it. Somebody is going to get a prepared driver or two without paying a dime to develop him. That's the whole story, really.

Chevy and Ford wanted to keep their little sport private--that's what pissed Jack off. They couldn't. Tough. Find a better way.....
 
So if I've been looking lately the dominos we're all waiting for are the 1, 14, and 41 as far as top rides?

My thoughts

1 if Kurt isn't back in the car I think chip does everything possible to get Ross in the car

14 this one I could see go either way. I think they want Clint back but I'm not sure Gene wants to keep paying. Nobody immediately jumps to mind as someone I think they really want in the ride except Larson and it's sounds like he's got at least another year left.

41 I just don't think Suarez is long for this ride. He hasn't been putting up stellar numbers in either top notch ride since jumping to cup. Just me purely guessing I think Custer gets this ride next year. They have a lot of money stuck into his development and I'm not sure another year in Xfinity will do him much good.

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wi_racefan said:
So if I've been looking lately the dominos we're all waiting for are the 1, 14, and 41 as far as top rides?

My thoughts

1 if Kurt isn't back in the car I think chip does everything possible to get Ross in the car

14 this one I could see go either way. I think they want Clint back but I'm not sure Gene wants to keep paying. Nobody immediately jumps to mind as someone I think they really want in the ride except Larson and it's sounds like he's got at least another year left.

41 I just don't think Suarez is long for this ride. He hasn't been putting up stellar numbers in either top notch ride since jumping to cup. Just me purely guessing I think Custer gets this ride next year. They have a lot of money stuck into his development and I'm not sure another year in Xfinity will do him much good.

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Suarez sucks but from what I understand the only reason he came on is because eventually you will see arris on that car in a significant matter. But the deal with JGR is hindering that from happening until next year.
 
wi_racefan said:
1 if Kurt isn't back in the car I think chip does everything possible to get Ross in the car
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Monster has made a habit of waiting until relatively late in Silly Season to renew. I've read here they want to maintain a presence in NASCAR after the title sponsorship expires. Kurt's performing better than Kyle L., and much better than Jamie Mac did. He'll be back next year.
 
LFR is officially dancing with the devil.

How many years before they're out of business?

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Right, Bob. The minnows won’t need any engineering help.

Quite possibly the dumbest thing I’ve read in quite a while.
 
Biggreen695 said:
LFR is officially dancing with the devil.

How many years before they're out of business?

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Retaining Rheem is huge for LFR, I hope they continue to grow. I really like Bob Levine as well, he seems like a really nice man who is very open with the fans.

LFR has grown from the part-time days with no sponsor and Scott Speed driving for them. To see them growing to this point is what its about IMO, I enjoy seeing fledgling teams growing as such. They are not going anywhere, anytime soon. Best of luck to them now and into the future. This partnership with Toyota, I hope it works out long-term.
 
Lol Brandon Jones should get a stake in the team considering he’s effectively been funding bell for 2 years now :p


Will be interesting to see how Jones performs next year since bell will be gone. Maybe he will get the top team and resources and can get a win or two. If Custer moves up to cup along with Reddick and Bell Xfinity will be very interesting next season.
 
wi_racefan said:
Don't get fooled into thinking this C Bell thing is a long term solution. JGR will not continue to keep a driver under salary and have them racing for another team. I see this as a 1, possibly 2 year solution. At that point someone in the "family" will be looking for a new ride.
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I don't think anyone is under the impression Bell is there long-term. Leavine is hoping to use the affiliation and performance boost as a stepping stone and bridge until 2021. He seems sold on the concept that the costs and dependence on larger team resources will be reduced then. Or he's hoping (I think the skepticism expressed above is apt). Still, what alternative does he have if he wants to be competitive?
 
Dumbest thing I've read today is that Twatter is worth $500 Billion. At that valuation they should sponsor a couple teams.
 
Sorry, I dont know how to clean this up.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Roush Fenway Racing says it will part ways with Ricky Stenhouse Jr. at the end of the season. He will be replaced by Chris Buescher in the No. 17 car.</p>&mdash; Jeff Gluck (@jeff_gluck) <a href="">September 25, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
Mike Crayne said:
Sorry, I dont know how to clean this up.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Roush Fenway Racing says it will part ways with Ricky Stenhouse Jr. at the end of the season. He will be replaced by Chris Buescher in the No. 17 car.</p>&mdash; Jeff Gluck (@jeff_gluck) <a href="">September 25, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
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Oh wow, very unexpected.

Seems like Roush is not screwing around now. Good on them, as I like Stenhouse, but he's far to inconsistent and has been for years. I wonder if anyone will be interested in him or does he go back to racing on dirt?

Great for Buescher as well, a team of Buescher and Newman sounds lethal. Hopefully, it works out and hopefully Ricky will land on his feet somewhere. Ricky has his glimpses, but Buescher is a massive upgrade.

So, what's up with the 37 next year? JTG-Daughtery expected Preece and Buescher to re-sign.
 
Mike Crayne said:
Sorry, I dont know how to clean this up.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Roush Fenway Racing says it will part ways with Ricky Stenhouse Jr. at the end of the season. He will be replaced by Chris Buescher in the No. 17 car.</p>&mdash; Jeff Gluck (@jeff_gluck) <a href="">September 25, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
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'Bout time.
 
Man silly season is getting crazy!!!
Reddit now proclaims Stenhouse to the 41???

I'm thinking Hemric to JTG?
 
Good move for Roush, and also for Buescher IMO. And yet another data point showing that many driver contracts in Nascar are far from guarantees, if one accepts at face value Ricky's recent statement that his deal with RFR runs through 2021.

I wonder what's up at JTG Daugherty. They have been candid that sponsorship funding to retain Buescher was not yet finalized, but recent reports have seemed rather positive that all was on track to get that done. I wonder if Buescher is leaving because he can't stay, or if he is seizing a better opportunity. My guess... a better opportunity.
 
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