Uh Oh...Cheater cheater pumpkin eater...L1 for the 4 team

kyle18fan said:
I don't consider the infraction " pushing it to the limit " ... and I stated that.
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You may well have stated that, but I wasn't replying to you. Call it what you want. My response to Snappy D remains the same: no one responsible is getting fired from SHR over this infraction.
 
gnomesayin said:
The culture of NASCAR and.a lot of racing is such that it is a given that teams are always pushing the boundaries as much as the can. There are the rules as written, and there is rules enforcement, which are separate. For instance, if the pit road speed limit is 45 MPH, and NASCAR let's it be known there is a 5 MPH tolerance, teams will go 50, then 51, then 52, until they are penalized. If a rule states 2 inches with an 1/8" tolerance, what is the rule in practice? If a rule states a part should remain rigid and not flex, teams will figure how much flex they can get away with. That's the game.

There are a bunch of possible real world analogies to explain. If I get away with speeding down the interstate every day for a month, but then get a speeding ticket for going 63 in a 55 the next day, that doesn't harm the credibility of the state patrol because I didn't get caught all of the other times.
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Thank you good real world analogy. Don’t speed I did that a lot in my 20’s. It’s costly.
 
Snappy D said:
Holy $hit so was it the rear spoiler that was being flexed with air flow as the car drove through a turn is that what I am understanding?
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No idea. I posted it to give an idea of the theories out there. Hope that clarifies my post.
 
StandOnIt said:
along the same lines, many are saying if the car passes inspection at the beginning of the race that should be the only inspection..ha ha haa. Cars will be morphing into something else during the race the next time they hit the track. i think there is some of that going on now to be honest
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Yes. Those statements are extremely naive, and the teams are way ahead of that nonsense.

The "What about Miami?" question is a fair one, I guess, but it is just another reason why a racing series championship should never be determined by the results of a single race.
 
gnomesayin said:
Yes. Those statements are extremely naive, and the teams are way ahead of that nonsense.

The "What about Miami?" is a fair one, I guess, but it is just another reason why a racing series championship should never be determined by the results of a single race.
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Johnson almost didn't make the race when he won his last championship. They scrutinize the hell out of the final four before the race, and after they do tear down after the race..nothing like taking them back to the tech center though.
 
I posted a clip of Johnson's last restart when he out ran Larson. He couldn't have had a rev limiter on the car, that thing was screaming thru every gear.
 
DUN24 said:
Almost every season finale, the top four in the championship are the top 4 in the race by large margins. Some years it's more pronounced than others but there have been a few where it looks like the championship contenders are racing in a different class all together.
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gnomesayin said:
A widely held theory, and one that has even had knowledgeable insider comments here supporting it. It is rather obvious that NASCAR prefers the Homestead Bowl to come down to the four finalists racing each other for the win and the title, and it is not unreasonable to believe they are willing to encourage this in various ways. A vast conspiracy is not required.
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There's no doubt in my mind NASCAR isn't as strict on the "Final 4" at Homestead. They put so much emphasis on this playoff format and the last race, they want to make sure all the contenders are battling each other up front. And the "fastest cars all year" argument is flawed. Remember the year Newman miraculously worked his way into the final? He only had like three top 5's all year, yet he managed to finish 2nd at Homestead. :idunno:
 
Snappy D said:
Holy $hit so was it the rear spoiler that was being flexed with air flow as the car drove through a turn is that what I am understanding?
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Why would they attach the spoiler in a manner that allowed it to flex?

How would that help?
 
couple observations. notice how the 4 car has been out to lunch the last few races. lets just say not really tearing it up. I think they saved this for the texas race gambling on getting away with it. Also notice how the 4 car isn't setting the fastest time in practice. Then the race comes along and they pull a second on the second place car in 3 laps. Your left wondering, ummm 3 tenths a lap huh? where was that during practice. The 4 car has something. I keep wondering if HMS thinks and wonders when are these guys gonna get caught, then we will be faster than they are because we developed something different.
 
hidesert cowboy said:
couple observations. notice how the 4 car has been out to lunch the last few races. lets just say not really tearing it up. I think they saved this for the texas race gambling on getting away with it. Also notice how the 4 car isn't setting the fastest time in practice. Then the race comes along and they pull a second on the second place car in 3 laps. Your left wondering, ummm 3 tenths a lap huh? where was that during practice. The 4 car has something. I keep wondering if HMS thinks and wonders when are these guys gonna get caught, then we will be faster than they are because we developed something different.
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in the last 4 out of five races the farthest back Harvick has qualified is 3rd, but yeah their finishes have been worse.
 
I think the fact that they take only three cars for a full teardown and all three failed is a legitimate concern. Take the whole field and what are the odds those are the only three that fail? Several teams are probably grateful they happened to finish in 5th, 9th, 12th, what have you this past weekend. Obviously, doing more extensive at-track inspections or more voluminous inspections back at R&D is going to take all of more manpower, time, and space so it's hard to imagine any sort of compromise, but the idea of only a very select number of cars being torn down each week does not sit well.

That said, after seeing what Bob said I still can't excuse SHR for doing something so blatant and not even remotely worth the risk.
 
FLRacingFan said:
I think the fact that they take only three cars for a full teardown and all three failed is a legitimate concern. Take the whole field and what are the odds those are the only three that fail? Several teams are probably grateful they happened to finish in 5th, 9th, 12th, what have you this past weekend. Obviously, doing more extensive at-track inspections or more voluminous inspections back at R&D is going to take all of more manpower, time, and space so it's hard to imagine any sort of compromise, but the idea of only a very select number of cars being torn down each week does not sit well.

That said, after seeing what Bob said I still can't excuse SHR for doing something so blatant and not even remotely worth the risk.
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nah just trying to get a guaranteed seat in the final four. Ain't nothing to it
 
StandOnIt said:
they are going to be trying to get rid of downforce next year :p get that thing trimmed out.
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I think Blaney alluded to this at the Atlanta test. At some (most?) tracks the extra downforce just isn't going to be worth the drag. It sounds like NASCAR is going to start inspecting spoilers at the track now but I very much doubt that means the end of any funny business going on back there.

 
FLRacingFan said:
I think Blaney alluded to this at the Atlanta test. At some (most?) tracks the extra downforce just isn't going to be worth the drag. It sounds like NASCAR is going to start inspecting spoilers at the track now but I very much doubt that means the end of any funny business going on back there.

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I know that is hard to believe that Nascar is trying to take the F-1 out of it. They might have them for awhile next year. take out too much downforce and the car drives like crap, too much downforce and the car is slow. I am sure the teams will figure it out sooner or later, but for awhile I think they will be shaking their heads.
 
FLRacingFan said:
I think Blaney alluded to this at the Atlanta test. At some (most?) tracks the extra downforce just isn't going to be worth the drag. It sounds like NASCAR is going to start inspecting spoilers at the track now but I very much doubt that means the end of any funny business going on back there.

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I'm good with taking the win for something as serious as this.
 
FLRacingFan said:
I think Blaney alluded to this at the Atlanta test. At some (most?) tracks the extra downforce just isn't going to be worth the drag. It sounds like NASCAR is going to start inspecting spoilers at the track now but I very much doubt that means the end of any funny business going on back there.

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What does this have to do with todays rules and spoiler heights?
 
http://www.espn.com/racing/nascar/s...lties-include-no-automatic-championship-berth

"Miller said while the spoiler was the correct height, it was offset to the right between 0.2 and 0.3 inches. He said that would help the car aerodynamically. There was no question the part was designed to violate the rules, he said.

"It's as black and white as it gets," Miller said."

"Starting at Phoenix this weekend, NASCAR will remove the spoilers from the cars to make sure they are legal. It previously would just measure the height and length, believing because it is a spec part, it should be legal."
 
TexasRaceLady said:
I would say that passing off an in-house manufactured spoiler as a regulation one is really out of bounds.
I would hope that next year, taking a win or handing out a "did not finish" is warranted for such egregious breaking
of the rules.
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If this is the case, he should never be scored turning a lap. He wasnt there. On top of that, I believe every car in SHR had the same thing.
 
Nascar is their own worse enemy when it comes to car inspections. Saying we are going to get tough one week and then at Texas allow them to fail two or three times I don't know what they expect. Most of it is tied into molly coddling the sponsors. They need to grow a pair and say this is the way it is period.
 
StandOnIt said:
Nascar is their own worse enemy when it comes to car inspections. Saying we are going to get tough one week and then at Texas allow them to fail two or three times I don't know what they expect. Most of it is tied into molly coddling the sponsors. They need to grow a pair and say this is the way it is period.
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