What Do you Think of the New Package?

FLRacingFan said:
Depends on how many timing loops a track has but it's a matter of simply changing position between each loop on the track - so you could be side-by-side with a car for a lap and nose ahead of each other over the course of the lap and change 'position' several times. Most elsewhere I see 'pass' counters they only tally at the end of the lap but it's also hard to put timing loops around race tracks, especially non-ovals. Some series only ever score at the line even.

That said, given that it's all done electronically the majority of passing comes under pit cycles, where it's very easy for someone to change position a net of 60 times over a cycle...there are a lot of things loop data is good for but passing statistics should be taken with a grain of salt for the most part, or at least taken in context with those other factors. Restarts are also a big inflator of 'passes'.
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Ok, so it's likely a very misleading stat then. Much like yards after contact in football.
 
The stats will continually show better results with this package, so that excuse can be used the whole year for the most part. Not all races will be that way, so the bring back 2018 ers can stay alive and vibrant for the rest of the season. Meanwhile 3 out of four races have shown an up tic in interest. :idunno:
 
StandOnIt said:
The stats will continually show better results with this package, so that excuse can be used the whole year for the most part. Not all races will be that way, so the bring back 2018 ers can stay alive and vibrant for the rest of the season. Meanwhile 3 out of four races have shown an up tic in interest. :idunno:
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The only track where your box score changed significantly at was Las Vegas.
 
Kiante said:
Can Goodyear make softer-tires with some sort of falloff?

The super-ultra hard compound yesterday and tires had ZERO falloff. NASCAR should have some words with Goodyear engineers.
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Goodyear can but then everyone will be bitching when a half dozen cars have walled it by the middle of the first stage.
 
StandOnIt said:
The stats will continually show better results with this package, so that excuse can be used the whole year for the most part. Not all races will be that way, so the bring back 2018 ers can stay alive and vibrant for the rest of the season. Meanwhile 3 out of four races have shown an up tic in interest. :idunno:
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IDK about an uptick in interest as the ratings have been essentially flat over last year’s bloodbath and attendance has not been great. Take a look at the demographics too as that will help give the whole story.
 
StandOnIt said:
shocking :p
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Other than the shocking attendance I think everything has been about how one would expect it to be in Nascar this year. Hopefully Bristol will get things turned around with solid attendance and lots of interest.......and a good race!
 
I can't seem to get it right, attendance is shocking, or slashing or is the whole thing a bloodbath? :idunno: I thought it was racing not HBO. :p
 
Spotter22 said:
He already knows Bristol wont have a sold out crowd for the spring race so he setting himself up for the next round of negative posts.
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And it goes from bloodbath to hopeful like a merry go round every week.o_O I'm hopeful they get a decent tire and soon. Goodyear went way overboard..or more like didn't do a thing. Glad some of the press are talking about it. Put some light on the tire boys, they are slacking.
 
eee ouch another one of those durn charts again
D3E8U20W0AAv-BV.jpg:large
 
StandOnIt said:
I can't seem to get it right, attendance is shocking, or slashing or is the whole thing a bloodbath? :idunno: I thought it was racing not HBO. :p
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What it means is attendance isn’t great and it’s not improving. I typed as slow I could!
 
Spotter22 said:
He already knows Bristol wont have a sold out crowd for the spring race so he setting himself up for the next round of negative posts.
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On the contrary as I heard Bristol covered up a bunch of seats so it could easily sell out. The Bristol spring race has to be good for 60k. It’s Bristol baby..,...the last great mausoleum!!!
 
FLRacingFan said:
Depends on how many timing loops a track has but it's a matter of simply changing position between each loop on the track - so you could be side-by-side with a car for a lap and nose ahead of each other over the course of the lap and change 'position' several times. Most elsewhere I see 'pass' counters they only tally at the end of the lap but it's also hard to put timing loops around race tracks, especially non-ovals. Some series only ever score at the line even.

That said, given that it's all done electronically the majority of passing comes under pit cycles, where it's very easy for someone to change position a net of 60 times over a cycle...there are a lot of things loop data is good for but passing statistics should be taken with a grain of salt for the most part, or at least taken in context with those other factors. Restarts are also a big inflator of 'passes'.
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Raw passing stats are well known to be unreliable and wonky as a qualitative indicator. Do you have a good source or knowledge about how the 'quality passes' metric is calculated?
 
Hmmm this one had Green passes for the lead..IDK maybe that one can be sluffed off or ignored somehow. :idunno: I coulda sworn that is what they said they were trying to accomplish with the newer package.
 
I have have never lived in an area where the quality of a game or a race has been determined by completions, shots on goal, saves, tackles or sack or any other stat.
 
StandOnIt said:
it's one of the reasons it is posted. entertainment. I can only imagine Gluck's teeth grinding when he had to post it was number one. He has been hating on the package all year. :p
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Most professionals and most others that have worked in professional capacities don’t think that way. They aren’t personally involved like you are therefore they are just reporting on something and remain detached. We don’t hate things and we don’t take things personally.
 
IanMcVittie said:
Most professionals and most others that have worked in professional capacities don’t think that way. They aren’t personally involved like you are therefore they are just reporting on something and remain detached. We don’t hate things and we don’t take things personally.
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you obviously don't follow Jeff Gluck or many other twitter reporters. Thinking that today's social media press is non committal is a Pollyanna dream long gone
 
I want the cars at the edge of control...all the time. Want stock body packages without all the aero add on crap. Want tires to wear out...drivers to have the skill to accommodate.
 
FLRacingFan said:
Depends on how many timing loops a track has but it's a matter of simply changing position between each loop on the track - so you could be side-by-side with a car for a lap and nose ahead of each other over the course of the lap and change 'position' several times. Most elsewhere I see 'pass' counters they only tally at the end of the lap but it's also hard to put timing loops around race tracks, especially non-ovals. Some series only ever score at the line even.

That said, given that it's all done electronically the majority of passing comes under pit cycles, where it's very easy for someone to change position a net of 60 times over a cycle...there are a lot of things loop data is good for but passing statistics should be taken with a grain of salt for the most part, or at least taken in context with those other factors. Restarts are also a big inflator of 'passes'.
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Any pre-stage numbers should be thrown out when making comparisons to today's numbers, imo. Those three planned cautions and restarts add a lot of ticks to the counter.
 
StandOnIt said:
you obviously don't follow Jeff Gluck or many other twitter reporters. Thinking that today's social media press is non committal is a Pollyanna dream long gone
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I have no interest in Twitter and don’t know Gluck. Evidently you think he is not a pro and will be upset about people liking dumbed down racing. Professional people don’t have hissy fits or get mad over things like that.
 
gnomesayin said:
Raw passing stats are well known to be unreliable and wonky as a qualitative indicator. Do you have a good source or knowledge about how the 'quality passes' metric is calculated?
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I am pretty sure 'quality' is simply those passes taking place within the Top 15.
 
FLRacingFan said:
I am pretty sure 'quality' is simply those passes taking place within the Top 15.
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Oh. Wow, yeah, that's scarcely more useful.

Far more than restarts, an extra green flag pit cycle produces many hundreds of green flag passes. This is just a general observation. I don't argue that stats determine or indicate the quality of racing.
 
I don't know what is being counted or when, but more is more even if it doesn't mean much. For instance I like hearing that the 41 is improved over the 19 from last year. That means to me that Suarez made a 'good' switch for him. The 19 is doing worse than the 78 from last year and that means the switch was not as good for him. Passing stats for the 19 will improve as Pearn and Truex gel with the previously fractured team. Suarez went to a intact team and they too will improve as they get used to Daniel. Passes, finishes all point to the improvement, finishes are the big numbers, but little ones count and improve till the finishes reflect that. So I like passing stats, just a drop of unimportant info, but I like them.
 
StandOnIt said:
eee ouch another one of those durn charts again
D3E8U20W0AAv-BV.jpg:large
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Just listened to Dale JR download and Steve Phelps said they had 3400 passes for position compared to 1700 last year. Phelps mentioned that TV was focusing too much on the front of the field so hopefully FOX starts covering more of the mid-field battles.
 
A lot of it was getting the traction compound dialed in, but record numbers of passes for the lead was a significant part. What was KDB carping about before the race about hard to pass?

 
StandOnIt said:
A lot of it was getting the traction compound dialed in, but record numbers of passes for the lead was a significant part. What was KDB carping about before the race about hard to pass?

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We love loop data and I consulted it before making my mind up if I liked the race or not. I saw Kevin Harvick pass a lot of cars on the leaderboard today too.
 
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