'21 Generation 7 Car news

Mispeedway15

Team Owner
Joined
May 22, 2016
Messages
2,217
Points
243
I will say I do hope GM gets it together. It’s laughable how much better our CRV and Acura RDX are than the Equinox and it’s Cadillac version are, especially considering price. And then when you compare the Accord and Civic to what Chevy is pumping out it isn’t even close.

Even look in Indycar, Team Penske are essentially the only competitive Chevys with Honda thoroughly cleaning up the Top 10 weekly. I believe their manufacturers points lead was 59 heading into Road America.

Just not seeing the pure innovation out of GM that we once did. Crazy to see considering how they dominated nascar up until the mid 2010s, and now we’re in a time where Toyota owns
 

Team Penske

Team Owner
Joined
Jan 16, 2015
Messages
6,022
Points
643
GM is closing the whole plant in Oshawa where they produce the Comaro.
Apparently GM is pissed that Dodge is still winning races in the "Pinty Series"
run mostly in Canada.
 

AuzGrams

Team Owner
Joined
Sep 18, 2016
Messages
3,443
Points
343
I will say I do hope GM gets it together. It’s laughable how much better our CRV and Acura RDX are than the Equinox and it’s Cadillac version are, especially considering price. And then when you compare the Accord and Civic to what Chevy is pumping out it isn’t even close.

Even look in Indycar, Team Penske are essentially the only competitive Chevys with Honda thoroughly cleaning up the Top 10 weekly. I believe their manufacturers points lead was 59 heading into Road America.

Just not seeing the pure innovation out of GM that we once did. Crazy to see considering how they dominated nascar up until the mid 2010s, and now we’re in a time where Toyota owns
Yeah. It's real disappointing as a Chevy fan, and then I hear they're discontinuing the Camaro... it's like they want me to jump ship and drive a few Dodges...
 

LewTheShoe

Team Owner
Joined
Apr 21, 2016
Messages
3,722
Points
493
Steve Phelps went on SiriusXM radio last week, and it seems he is pondering whether it makes sense to introduce the Gen 7 chassis/body in 2021, and then come with new engines in 2022... or do it all at the same time in 2022.

“We look at the car in two pieces, right? So there is the body itself, chassis/body, and then you have the engine. The engine most likely would be a 2022 piece, so we have to determine to go new body style in 2021 or do you go new body style and engine at the same time in 2022?

“We’re trying to give ourselves some flexibility there..."

NBC Sports
 

gnomesayin

Team Owner
Joined
Oct 14, 2013
Messages
6,562
Points
793
I expect the teams would prefer to spread the conversion expenses over two seasons.
Roger Penske made comments a few months ago that suggested the team owners, or at least some of them, were behind the push to accelerate the Gen 7 timeline. Then subsequent reports followed that the teams want financial help from the sanctioning body to pay for the conversion costs. So who knows.
 

FLRacingFan

Team Owner
Joined
Feb 9, 2013
Messages
24,868
Points
883
Location
Florida
I read a week or two ago that Ford is looking for a spec hybrid solution that could be used across NASCAR, IMSA, and Aussie Supercars. Seems a little pie-in-the-sky to me, but regardless the point is that a lot of this stuff is very much TBD and the timeline will probably be shifted back a year or so. If the changes are going to be as wholesale as they're making them out to be, the 2021 Daytona 500 is not that far away.
 

Team Penske

Team Owner
Joined
Jan 16, 2015
Messages
6,022
Points
643
I read a week or two ago that Ford is looking for a spec hybrid solution that could be used across NASCAR, IMSA, and Aussie Supercars. Seems a little pie-in-the-sky to me, but regardless the point is that a lot of this stuff is very much TBD and the timeline will probably be shifted back a year or so. If the changes are going to be as wholesale as they're making them out to be, the 2021 Daytona 500 is not that far away.
But when your my age it could be eternity. LOL
 

OldTimer

Team Owner
Joined
Aug 25, 2017
Messages
427
Points
103
I will say I do hope GM gets it together. It’s laughable how much better our CRV and Acura RDX are than the Equinox and it’s Cadillac version are, especially considering price. And then when you compare the Accord and Civic to what Chevy is pumping out it isn’t even close.

Even look in Indycar, Team Penske are essentially the only competitive Chevys with Honda thoroughly cleaning up the Top 10 weekly. I believe their manufacturers points lead was 59 heading into Road America.

Just not seeing the pure innovation out of GM that we once did. Crazy to see considering how they dominated nascar up until the mid 2010s, and now we’re in a time where Toyota owns
Not a GM fan in anyway...but feel it necessary to defend them in regards to the products. Have had both of the Honda products you stated, and they are well engineered vehicles within the realm of what their intent is. Had the unpleasant experience of having to use a three month rental Equinox my company assigned to me before getting my Taurus AWD...the Equinox was or is a POS, no doubt. But...for my intent and purposes, the CRV was worse...wife convinced me to trade it in on the RDX, one year later, she is driving a used Ford Explorer (the last version with a frame under it) that she thinks is new (it is a 2010 with only 8,000 miles on it when purchased from a retired couple)....it is a quantum leap ahead of all three.

That being said, NASCAR was and is built around domestic manufactured vehicles...granted their have been a few blips....the Jaguar and now those rice burners, but for all intent and purposes it has revolved around domestic hardware. To change that, they might as well change the name since NASCAR will not exist anymore.
 

Mispeedway15

Team Owner
Joined
May 22, 2016
Messages
2,217
Points
243
Not a GM fan in anyway...but feel it necessary to defend them in regards to the products. Have had both of the Honda products you stated, and they are well engineered vehicles within the realm of what their intent is. Had the unpleasant experience of having to use a three month rental Equinox my company assigned to me before getting my Taurus AWD...the Equinox was or is a POS, no doubt. But...for my intent and purposes, the CRV was worse...wife convinced me to trade it in on the RDX, one year later, she is driving a used Ford Explorer (the last version with a frame under it) that she thinks is new (it is a 2010 with only 8,000 miles on it when purchased from a retired couple)....it is a quantum leap ahead of all three.

That being said, NASCAR was and is built around domestic manufactured vehicles...granted their have been a few blips....the Jaguar and now those rice burners, but for all intent and purposes it has revolved around domestic hardware. To change that, they might as well change the name since NASCAR will not exist anymore.
Well lol Honda and Toyota build all their cars over here that are American driven, with more American parts than most of their domestic counterparts. Just because it’s not headquartered in Detroit doesn’t mean it’s an unamerican automobile
 

Team Penske

Team Owner
Joined
Jan 16, 2015
Messages
6,022
Points
643
Well lol Honda and Toyota build all their cars over here that are American driven, with more American parts than most of their domestic counterparts. Just because it’s not headquartered in Detroit doesn’t mean it’s an unamerican automobile
The big difference is that here in Canada those vehicles are NOT Union Made and that makes them better simply because workers want to keep their jobs.
 

Charlie Spencer

Short tracks and road courses.
Joined
Oct 17, 2012
Messages
20,697
Points
883
Location
Lexington, SC
Just because it’s not headquartered in Detroit doesn’t mean it’s an unamerican automobile
The big difference is that here in Canada those vehicles are NOT Union Made and that makes them better simply because workers want to keep their jobs.
Boy, I wonder which one of these will cause the most meltdowns.
 

Formerjackman

Team Owner
Joined
Aug 15, 2017
Messages
3,345
Points
343
Not a GM fan in anyway...but feel it necessary to defend them in regards to the products. Have had both of the Honda products you stated, and they are well engineered vehicles within the realm of what their intent is. Had the unpleasant experience of having to use a three month rental Equinox my company assigned to me before getting my Taurus AWD...the Equinox was or is a POS, no doubt. But...for my intent and purposes, the CRV was worse...wife convinced me to trade it in on the RDX, one year later, she is driving a used Ford Explorer (the last version with a frame under it) that she thinks is new (it is a 2010 with only 8,000 miles on it when purchased from a retired couple)....it is a quantum leap ahead of all three.
On the other hand, My parents and one of my cousins are leasing Equinox's and think they are FABULOUS, especially at the lease price they are getting. My wife drives a 2007 Saturn Vue, not most most people's idea of a spectacular car, and we love that thing to death. Most reliable car I have ever owned. I guess you never know what people will like.
 

2 Sweet

Legend
Joined
Apr 21, 2016
Messages
3,567
Points
493
Location
Hilliard, OH
On the other hand, My parents and one of my cousins are leasing Equinox's and think they are FABULOUS, especially at the lease price they are getting. My wife drives a 2007 Saturn Vue, not most most people's idea of a spectacular car, and we love that thing to death. Most reliable car I have ever owned. I guess you never know what people will like.
Wife's 2013 Equinox has been flawless....



85k miles so far without a single problem. Chrome wheels, dual exhaust, 300 horsepower, comfy interior with plenty of room. For a cheap crossover, it's been wonderful.

My dad has a '13 Buick Enclave, also a 3.6L, and he's over 160k miles. No issues whatsoever.
 

OldTimer

Team Owner
Joined
Aug 25, 2017
Messages
427
Points
103
85k miles so far without a single problem. Chrome wheels, dual exhaust, 300 horsepower, comfy interior with plenty of room. For a cheap crossover, it's been wonderful.
Try towing four ATV's or 24' boat with it...useless as boobs on a warthog. Worse yet...has all the controls designed around the "international" ergonomics instead of the good 'ole USA version in the Ford's (except for their quasi international poop boxes).

That being said, I expect 250,000 miles out of my vehicles...which happens quite often. My Taurus right now just broke over the 200k mark, probably about seven or so months from reaching 250k. My wife's previous Explorer (not her current 2010, that just now went over 40k) had 346k on it when we bought the CRV, that thing is still running around the neighborhood though. My F150 is still pretty new though...only 30k...it replaced my '95 F150 with 420k on it (towed race cars all over the country, don't do that anymore, have a 379 Long Hood Pete for that now).

Oh yeah...almost forgot...my '02 Mercury Grand Marquis....510k and counting...just put another set of tires on it and replaced all the ball joints, tie rod ends, and bushings (front and rear). There is a reason the cops still use this platform...parts are cheap, easy, and available.
 

ChexOrWrex

Ya gotta wanna
Joined
May 19, 2013
Messages
22,313
Points
883
Wife's 2013 Equinox has been flawless....



85k miles so far without a single problem. Chrome wheels, dual exhaust, 300 horsepower, comfy interior with plenty of room. For a cheap crossover, it's been wonderful.

My dad has a '13 Buick Enclave, also a 3.6L, and he's over 160k miles. No issues whatsoever.
Those model equinoxes with the 2.4L start excessively burning oil around 100k miles. Keep an eye out.
 

zevious

Team Owner
Joined
Sep 5, 2002
Messages
654
Points
373
On the other hand, My parents and one of my cousins are leasing Equinox's and think they are FABULOUS, especially at the lease price they are getting. My wife drives a 2007 Saturn Vue, not most most people's idea of a spectacular car, and we love that thing to death. Most reliable car I have ever owned. I guess you never know what people will like.
Does it have the V6? If so, that is sourced from Honda.
 

Mispeedway15

Team Owner
Joined
May 22, 2016
Messages
2,217
Points
243
Well first off I do wanna say with technological improvements in CAD software there aren't really junk cars anymore. But in general your everyday drivers are going to trend better with Honda and Toyota than the American cars. But when it comes to muscle cars, full size trucks and full size SUVs they definitely bring home the bacon. If you were to rank them in order of size I'd go F150, GMC Yukon, Toyota 4Runner, Honda CRV, Honda Accord, Toyota Camry with Mustang winning the muscle car division
 

Charlie Spencer

Short tracks and road courses.
Joined
Oct 17, 2012
Messages
20,697
Points
883
Location
Lexington, SC
Well first off I do wanna say with technological improvements in CAD software there aren't really junk cars anymore.
Okay, you lost me. The CAD monkeys can crank out the most accurate designs, but what are those worth if the manufacturing processes aren't any good?
 

LewTheShoe

Team Owner
Joined
Apr 21, 2016
Messages
3,722
Points
493
Goodyear confirms the plan for Gen 7 is to go to 18" wheels, up from the 15" used for decades. The lower-profile tires are part of the "road relevance" objective for the Gen 7 car. Quoting Greg Stucker, Goodyear Director of Racing, "If you look at cars on the street, you don’t see too many 15-inch wheel diameters anymore. So, we are looking at larger wheel diameters and our target is 18-inch.”

Stucker added, "We will probably also add some width to the tire, so we will go with a little bit wider wheel, a little bit wider tire...

“You can’t say a wider tire is going to be better than a narrower tire,” Stucker said. “We’ll have to tune construction, we’ll have to tune compounds for a wider tire. All those different things will come into play. So, the goal will be to make sure we hit the sweet spot on every racetrack that we run...."

EXCLUSIVE: Goodyear, NASCAR believe bigger will be better for the Cup Series

http://kickinthetires.net/exclusive-goodyear-nascar-believe-bigger-will-be-better-for-the-cup-series/
 

Formerjackman

Team Owner
Joined
Aug 15, 2017
Messages
3,345
Points
343
Does it have the V6? If so, that is sourced from Honda.
Yes it does, one of the reasons I like the car so much. Runs smoother and has more power than the other engines that GM used in that generation of those SUVs. The Honda transmission, not nearly as good. Even with REGULAR fluid changes and using the correct Honda sourced fluid, it shifts kind of crappy.
 

Charlie Spencer

Short tracks and road courses.
Joined
Oct 17, 2012
Messages
20,697
Points
883
Location
Lexington, SC
Goodyear confirms the plan for Gen 7 is to go to 18" wheels, up from the 15" used for decades. The lower-profile tires are part of the "road relevance" objective for the Gen 7 car. Quoting Greg Stucker, Goodyear Director of Racing, "If you look at cars on the street, you don’t see too many 15-inch wheel diameters anymore. So, we are looking at larger wheel diameters and our target is 18-inch.”

Stucker added, "We will probably also add some width to the tire, so we will go with a little bit wider wheel, a little bit wider tire...

“You can’t say a wider tire is going to be better than a narrower tire,” Stucker said. “We’ll have to tune construction, we’ll have to tune compounds for a wider tire. All those different things will come into play. So, the goal will be to make sure we hit the sweet spot on every racetrack that we run...."

EXCLUSIVE: Goodyear, NASCAR believe bigger will be better for the Cup Series

http://kickinthetires.net/exclusive-goodyear-nascar-believe-bigger-will-be-better-for-the-cup-series/
I have an ignorant question. If the tire diameter increases 3 inches, what does that do to the shock set-up? Or even the shocks themselves? Is there enough play in the current shocks to accommodate 3 extra inches and still have enough range to make adjustments? Will shock manufacturers have to come out with new models?

For that matter, what about camber and other settings? Are the crew chiefs' notes on these going to be useless?
 

Revman

2X CHAMPION
Joined
Jan 12, 2014
Messages
8,886
Points
793
I have an ignorant question. If the tire diameter increases 3 inches, what does that do to the shock set-up? Or even the shocks themselves? Is there enough play in the current shocks to accommodate 3 extra inches and still have enough range to make adjustments? Will shock manufacturers have to come out with new models?

For that matter, what about camber and other settings? Are the crew chiefs' notes on these going to be useless?
I think those are damn good questions! Holy crap! Shock R&D can't be cheap. Are the crew chiefs' note worth anything this year anyway with the package change?
 

Formerjackman

Team Owner
Joined
Aug 15, 2017
Messages
3,345
Points
343
My guess is that while the rim diameter will be larger, the overall tire diameter will probably stay somewhere close to where it is. In theory, the sidewalls on the new tires should have a lot less flex and give in them, but a lot will depend on just how Goodyear builds the tire. Yes, I would say all the current shock notes will be useless, but that stuff changes all of the time anyway. Half the time what you ran in the spring race at a track will be out to lunch by the fall race anyway. I imagine a LOT of this stuff will get figured out on the 7 post rig before it is ever run, assuming the teams can get something close to the actual tires to be used ahead of the events.
 

LewTheShoe

Team Owner
Joined
Apr 21, 2016
Messages
3,722
Points
493
I have an ignorant question. If the tire diameter increases 3 inches, what does that do to the shock set-up? Or even the shocks themselves? Is there enough play in the current shocks to accommodate 3 extra inches and still have enough range to make adjustments? Will shock manufacturers have to come out with new models?

For that matter, what about camber and other settings? Are the crew chiefs' notes on these going to be useless?
It's for Gen 7. There is no notebook on Gen 7 setups yet, starting over whether it's 15" or 18" wheels.
 

DewChaser988

NASCAR fan since 1998
Joined
Apr 22, 2018
Messages
1,682
Points
243
Location
Tamarac, Florida
Warning massive wall of text incoming...

The biggest problem with NASCAR right now, isn't the stagnant schedule nor is it rules inconsistency or constant rule changes (I'll address them in another post), It's the on track product that is the main issue. Which is generally a result of a car that is too aero sensitive, while the current aero package is a step in the right direction, I feel like there is still so much to do in terms of improving the racing itself. The following list is primarily is based off what we already know about the Gen 7 car, combined with what I'd personally like to see.
**THE ENGINE**
As a racing series built on the "Win on Sunday, Sell on Monday" principle, I feel like in terms of automotive technology, NASCAR Cup engines need to reflect the latest in automotive industry trends. The automotive industry is trending to electrification at the moment, however, based on current EV technology, there is no way a fully electric vehicle can met the current demands of NASCAR Cup Series racing. Hybrid ICE/Electric engines are the way to go for now.
Personally, I feel like the new engine package
should be a turbocharged 500HP V8 ICE, combined with 2 250 horsepower electric motors on the front and rear axels for a combined total of 1,000HP.
As for an ERS, instead of KERS (which uses braking energy), an EHRS (exhaust heat recovery system) is used. The EHRS system harnesses the heat from the exhaust gas and
turns it into electrical energy which is stored in a battery and can be used by the driver at any time during a race for a boost of 50 horsepower in the electric motors for 5 seconds.
**THE CHASSIS**
The Chassis is a steel tube frame and specifically designed to where a team no longer needs to build track specific cars, which means less chassis need to be built, therefore also saving the team money.
**THE BODY**
First things first, the practice of skewing the sides of the race cars out in an extreme manner is officially banned. You heard me right, the Twisted Sisters are gone. It has been pretty well established, that the biggest problem with the racing for years has been sideforce, plus it totally defeats the point of designing the cars to resemble their production counterparts, which is one of the entire points of the Gen 7 car.
Essentially, I'm using that X-3 car that was tested at Kansas a little while ago as a template for the car's aerodynamics. It eliminated sideforce by engineering the car to be equal in the front and back as well as left and right which would keep it straight around corners. At the front, a bulge was created, making it impossible to seal off which would allow for greater downforce. By eliminating sideforce, the air would flow easier over the car which would allow clean air for the car behind.
[This video by Realradman could explain the aerodynamics of the X-3 car and the big aerodynamic issues with the current car better than I could]( In addition to solving the aero sensitivity problem, making the cars as close to symmetrical as possible, will make
As for the body itself, it's a fiberglass composite. Based off of the composite bodies run in the Xfinity series. By switching to flange fit composite body panels, less time will be spent in the body shop and in the wind tunnel, saving teams time and money.
**MISCELLANEOUS**
We already know the car will have bigger wheels and bigger tires, as well as Independent Rear Suspensions.
Speaking of tires… one idea that NASCAR experimented with at the All Star Race a few years ago, that was never used to the fullest, was allowing teams to choose between tire compounds. I say, let's try that again in longer races for an entire season. It could open up a lot of new strategic options for teams. In order to prevent teams from gaming the system however, teams have to start the race on the same set of tires they qualified on. And they are limited to 2 or 3 sets of specific tire compounds per weekend. The tire type is denoted by the color of the "Goodyear Eagle" text on the sidewall. (The colors are derived from Goodyear's corporate color scheme).
White- Soft tires, the grippiest tire compound, but wears quick..
Yellow- The current tire compound is now considered the mediun tire.
Blue-Hard tires, Significantly less grippy, but they last longer.
Light Blue- Intermediate Tires, used for damp tracks and or light rain conditions.
Aqua Blue- Rain Tires.
Also, in order to return the sport, to it's "Win on Sunday, Sell On Monday" , the homologation rule is reinstated. In order for a car (or truck) model to be approved by NASCAR for competition, 5,000 cars of that model must be produced and sold to the general public.
 

Charlie Spencer

Short tracks and road courses.
Joined
Oct 17, 2012
Messages
20,697
Points
883
Location
Lexington, SC
In order to prevent teams from gaming the system however, teams have to start the race on the same set of tires they qualified on.
NASCAR tried that. I lead to teams slacking off in Q in order to reduce wear on the tires they'd have on at the start.

Other than that, I have no opinions.
 

Team Penske

Team Owner
Joined
Jan 16, 2015
Messages
6,022
Points
643
NASCAR tried that. I lead to teams slacking off in Q in order to reduce wear on the tires they'd have on at the start.

Other than that, I have no opinions.
Qualify and start 21 or slack off and start 31 makes little difference depending on track.
Starting 5th or 25th is another matter. You would use up the tires trying to recover.
I would rather start near front and block than start further back and try passing Newman. :D
 
Top Bottom