'21 Generation 7 Car news

bigspud said:
thats when this 35 year fan will stop watching,
when the busch series switched to v6 engines, it was like finger nails on a blackboard.
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I thought the big push with Jim taking over was they were trying to get back to what their longtime fans wanted because they alienated them chasing new ones?

I can tell you things like P2P and V6 engines are not things most long time fans will like

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wi_racefan said:
I thought the big push with Jim taking over was they were trying to get back to what their longtime fans wanted because they alienated them chasing new ones?

I can tell you things like P2P and V6 engines are not things most long time fans will like

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The industry is going broke. Changes must be made. i was completely against the last V-8 "Nascar" engine blueprint. They used to run engines based off production parts. Now they aren't really different than the Ford-Cosworth & Ilmor Mercedes from the standpoint of being strictly purpose built racing engines. I loved when Indycar had the "Stock" Block Buick. Times change. Do any of you still have a phone attached to the wall in your house? Not many I'd bet.
 
Meant to add i would think using the Gen 7 on a road course would be the best first test. They have tons of info available from the IMSA guys. I'm genuinely encouraged by the speculative info being tossed around. I don't care if the shifter in on the floor or steering wheel. Don't care how many lug nuts it has. Don't care if they only have 2 man crews. Does the car race well? Can the teams afford to race? That's all that matters. If it doesn't suit you go find a DeLorean and flux capacitor...
 
KTMLew01 said:
The industry is going broke. Changes must be made. i was completely against the last V-8 "Nascar" engine blueprint. They used to run engines based off production parts. Now they aren't really different than the Ford-Cosworth & Ilmor Mercedes from the standpoint of being strictly purpose built racing engines. I loved when Indycar had the "Stock" Block Buick. Times change. Do any of you still have a phone attached to the wall in your house? Not many I'd bet.
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show me any major series where they aren't purpose built engines. BTW Nascar has been increasing the engine rules so less engines can be used in the cars. They increased it again for next year. Nobody knows if or when a different engine besides a V8 is in the future. Nascar officials have said the new car has to have enough room for hybrid technology.
 
There is absolutely no reason to switch from a v8 engine. zero. nada. zilch. ktlew is there any reason why u think a v6 or 4 cylinder is better? you say changes must be made. I couldnt disagree more. none of us have wall phones because cell phones are much better so tell me how switching to a motor with less cylinders is better? just bc your prius doesnt have a v8 doesnt mean nascar should get rid of them for a more expensive but inferior motor.
 
I have no idea what engine(s) changes if any they are going to make. I thought they were going to paddle shifters and hell they still might do so. But they had a SuperCar transaxle and a 6 speed stick in the mule car. I really don't see getting all twisted until they come up with something concrete. In IMSA the Corvettes went from an 8 to a six cylinder. Does that mean they would go that way in Nascar? Would Nascar supply a bare block and teams take it from there? Who the heck knows.
 
The thing is Chevrolet and Ford do still have V8s in production. Toyota has never had a production V8 (except for Lexus, but that's a different brand). And that's what makes things complicated.
 
Not a fan of the sequential gear box idea. Also don’t see the point of independent suspension
 
dewchaser thats incorrect, toyota has made a v8 engine for decades and they use it in their lexus cars and toyota trucks and sport utility vehicles.

if u look at just about any stock car at any level of racing it probably has a v8 under the hood. theres a good reason for that. power and practicality. it makes no sense to consider a v6 or 4 cyl plus it would cost more
 
kyle busch 18 said:
dewchaser thats incorrect, toyota has made a v8 engine for decades and they use it in their lexus cars and toyota trucks and sport utility vehicles.

if u look at just about any stock car at any level of racing it probably has a v8 under the hood. theres a good reason for that. power and practicality. it makes no sense to consider a v6 or 4 cyl plus it would cost more
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It's kind of a moot point anyway, it isn't remotely the same engine that Nascar has required. The same thing applies to the GM and Ford cars, nobody makes a drop in engine for Nascar.
 
The latest on NASCAR’s Next Gen car
This although true seems a bit far fetched, the current teams are involved in testing:

Both the suspension and new tire-wheel combo illustrates the point of the Next-Gen car: The track-specific notes and setups that veteran teams like Hendrick, Joe Gibbs and Penske Racing go into the trash, in addition to specific experience with fuel mileage and fuel management, and even pit stops. This creates a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity for new manufacturers to jump in, because the is the most “level” the NASCAR Cup Series playing field will ever get.

https://www.jayski.com/2019/12/30/the-latest-on-nascars-next-gen-car/
 
Same info as Autoweek article. The current engines are purpose built from blueprint (spec) engines. Make them run a production based engine. The V-8 IS going away. You can stay and evolve or go. Your choice.
 
KTMLew01 said:
The V-8 IS going away. You can stay and evolve or go. Your choice.
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You know, The said exactly the same thing in 1980, 1990, and 1995. Yet the V8 is still here. Ford and Chevy have even recently introduced larger V8 gasoline engines for their pickups. I have a copy of a 1980 Hot Rod magazine celebrating the 25th anniversary of the Small Block Chevy. In the article, the "experts" concluded that by no later than 1986, ALL Chevy vehicles would be V6 or 4 Cyl. powered. The Small Block Chevy stayed in production another 20 years and was replaced by an even more awesome LS series V8 engine.
 
KTMLew01 said:
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What does a SB2 based engine have to do with anything? That's ancient technology. Now on a more relevant front, there IS a V6 version of the GM LS engine that certainly could be adapted to racing if the need be, not that I think it needs to be.
 
KTMLew01 said:
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I understand why he did this. GM has a 3.4 V6 in today's cars and if you want to rebuild it, just order the kit for the V8 (cheaper) and you will have 2 of everything left over because it is the the V8 with the back 2 cylinders cut off.
OK they did a little more than that.
 
Formerjackman said:
What does a SB2 based engine have to do with anything? That's ancient technology. Now on a more relevant front, there IS a V6 version of the GM LS engine that certainly could be adapted to racing if the need be, not that I think it needs to be.
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Has absolutely zero relevance to current car but is a REALLY cool video if you are a Motorhead. They just don't show us this stuff any more. LOVED IT!!!
 
Acs said:
Looks like the teams caved and we'll be getting a new Aero package for short tracks this year!
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Two things

1) they had to the short track racing last year was bad

2) we got down this bad road by listening to things like the drivers council and the RTA too much. Nascar needs to do what's best for the sport, not what teams and drivers want

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SpeedPagan said:
With some of the changes mirroring the IMSA series, I wonder if that means we'll see more road course racing in 2021?
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your guess is as good as any. IRS, larger brakes and wider tires are changes that the people in charge have said are coming for certain on the newer car and that makes it a much better car for road courses. I think we will be seeing track records being broken on road courses.
 
wi_racefan said:
Two things

1) they had to the short track racing last year was bad

2) we got down this bad road by listening to things like the drivers council and the RTA too much. Nascar needs to do what's best for the sport, not what teams and drivers want

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The days of being a dictator and forcing everybody to go along with whatever are long gone. It worked when there were 5 or more brands in the sport at the sports heyday, but didn't work previously years ago when Chrysler pulled out and Ford won almost all of the races. Nascar blinked and Chrysler came to the center a little so Dodges and Plymouths came back the next year. Same for today with just three OEM's and everybody trying to cut expenses, compromises were made. This one didn't work out and was changed ASAP.
 
StandOnIt said:
The days of being a dictator and forcing everybody to go along with whatever are long gone. It worked when there were 5 or more brands in the sport at the sports heyday, but didn't work previously years ago when Chrysler pulled out and Ford won almost all of the races. Nascar blinked and Chrysler came to the center a little so Dodges and Plymouths came back the next year. Same for today with just three OEM's and everybody trying to cut expenses, compromises were made. This one didn't work out and was changed ASAP.
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I really wish you wouldn't do that. Post stuff I have to agree with...:D
 
Letting team owners be in charge has never worked long term either. What the sport NEEDS is what it had for most of it's existence, a BENEVOLENT dictator. A person who would take other's opinion under consideration, but ultimately rule with an iron fist. I'm sensitive to the car owner's desire to cut expenses, BUT, if the product stinks, the whole exercise is a waste of time.
 
wi_racefan said:
2) we got down this bad road by listening to things like the drivers council and the RTA too much. Nascar needs to do what's best for the sport, not what teams and drivers want
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I prefer the perspective of racecar drivers and raceteam owners.

No sanctioning body should ever pay more than token, fake attention to the wants and needs of "the fans"
 
wi_racefan said:
Two things

1) they had to the short track racing last year was bad

2) we got down this bad road by listening to things like the drivers council and the RTA too much. Nascar needs to do what's best for the sport, not what teams and drivers want

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Your second point, I do not think they listen to the drivers. Its mainly the manfactuers for the most part playing a hand in these decisions. NASCAR has been listening to the manufacturers too much IMO, give me more input from drivers and the owners.
 
Nascar wanted a third package for short tracks and the manufacturers didn't want to spend the money staring at the expense of an entirely new car in the face/racing budget in a short time. I can see their reluctance to do so and their lack of confidence so quickly after the Brian's realm. Personally I don't know how many posts were ranting about Nascar not listening to fans during the Brian area as he crammed change after change to the series. Now this change was made quickly with the agreement of the fans AND the OEM's and there is a problem with something in the past?
We should be jumping with joy over the possibility of the short tracks coming back IMO
 
aunty dive said:
I prefer the perspective of racecar drivers and raceteam owners.

No sanctioning body should ever pay more than token, fake attention to the wants and needs of "the fans"
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Racers are mostly interested in what benefits them personally, not what is good for anybody else. Fans are nothing but customers. When you ignore your customers, you don't stay in business very long.
 
Formerjackman said:
Racers are mostly interested in what benefits them personally, not what is good for anybody else. Fans are nothing but customers. When you ignore your customers, you don't stay in business very long.
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These days you try to get all sides involved. Some days it has to be like herding cats, they all want it to benefit themselves the most. I do think it has hit them in the pocket book and they are working together for a common cause these days. Of course there are the loose cannons and we know who those are.
 
Formerjackman said:
Racers are mostly interested in what benefits them personally, not what is good for anybody else. Fans are nothing but customers. When you ignore your customers, you don't stay in business very long.
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This assumes that the customer knows something about how the product works.
 
Formerjackman said:
It doesn't matter. The customer is right, even when they're wrong. Their dollars are the ONLY reason the circus we call NASCAR exists.
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You sir hit the nail on the head. The big money of this sport is the reason it gets almost all of the top racing talent in this country, and what makes it so entertaining
 
Formerjackman said:
It doesn't matter. The customer is right, even when they're wrong. Their dollars are the ONLY reason the circus we call NASCAR exists.
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In this case, on any given race weekend, half the fans in the stands and watching at home are right. The other half are wrong.

They all reverse positions before the next race.

You must not spend much time on NASCAR forums.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
If the cars handle more like r/c cars, I wonder if we'll see the return of ringers?
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I don't recall the ringers being the front finishing cars. They want to come back fine but be prepared to be run off the track. These new drivers grew up in the times when nobody fails.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
If the cars handle more like r/c cars, I wonder if we'll see the return of ringers?
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Possibly for the intial year or two since they'd probably have an advantage being a road racer and the normal guys would have little experience in the new car. After a year or two I don't see the advantage anymore

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