Chase Elliott

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ChexOrWrex said:
You're talking as if the #9 team sits at a table and figures out what kind of penality they’d receive for doing X Y or Z, and then does their best to minimize the inevitable.

Thats not how any of this works. There is no “level of cheating”. There is only pushing until caught. The penalty leverage is then configured by NASCAR.
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I have no idea what you are talking about. Getting caught for something that everybody including the hot dog man knows they are looking hard at is dumb cheating. The Math is a separate issue..apparently Nascar thought it was pretty stupid also. They were more lenient with the winning car at Las Vegas than they were for a third place car.
 
StandOnIt said:
Harvick right or wrong stood behind his team. He didn't either cheat up the car or have a mechanical failure that he orchestrated. He as a leader brought his team together. So many drivers when the team gets caught try to distance themselves from what happened
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I'm fine with standing by his team, but I think he went about it the wrong way. Regardless of HOW it happened, the car didn't pass inspection, and NASCAR penalized him for it. If he wants to stand up for the team, just stick with the broken part story, and just say, "These cars have thousands of parts, and sometimes one of them breaks. My team gave me an AWESOME car today, I LOVE those guys."
 
Yeah Harvick so stoically stood behind that same team that he has so often dogged and dragged thru the mud. What a guy, I guess he's finally growing up at 42.

This same team got caught with tape last year and went on to have a post season that any other year would probably have won a championship. I'm not concerned whatsoever. Pointing out that he's now behind Bowman and is the 3rd HMS car in points might slip by the casual fan undetected, but you're not gonna fool anyone here into believing that's actually his appropriate place in the pecking order.
 
I don't think he asked you or me for advice. Looks like he did a hell of a job keeping his team in the limelight all week to me.
 
AdoubleU24 said:
Yeah Harvick so stoically stood behind that same team that he has so often dogged and dragged thru the mud. What a guy, I guess he's finally growing up at 42.

This same team got caught with tape last year and went on to have a post season that any other year would probably have won a championship. I'm not concerned whatsoever. Pointing out that he's now behind Bowman and is the 3rd HMS car in points might slip by the casual fan undetected, but you're not gonna fool anyone here into believing that's actually his appropriate place in the pecking order.
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yeah he probably if he has any luck be ahead of the rest of the Hendricks, but they dug a deeper hole after a lousy week before that.
 
AdoubleU24 said:
Yeah Harvick so stoically stood behind that same team that he has so often dogged and dragged thru the mud. What a guy, I guess he's finally growing up at 42.
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You bring up a good point. I would say Happy leads the league in throwing the pit crew under the transporter for bad pit stops over the last ten years.
 
StandOnIt said:
yeah so? what does that have anything to do with what happened ?
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YOU said Harvick was just standing by his team. If we start digging, we can find a WHOLE LOT of times when Kevin obviously did NOT do that. So he gets some accolades because he did it THIS time?
 
I guess you'll have to explain it for me, because as usual, you lost me several posts ago.
 
If that's the way you want it. I put value in trying to understand the point someone is trying to make. I'll just have to draw the conclusion that there WAS no point....
 
Formerjackman said:
If that's the way you want it. I put value in trying to understand the point someone is trying to make. I'll just have to draw the conclusion that there WAS no point....
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no you didn't, you changed the subject and then acted confused when you were called on it. Don't be a weasel bud.
 
StandOnIt said:
The Math is a separate issue..apparently Nascar thought it was pretty stupid also. They were more lenient with the winning car at Las Vegas than they were for a third place car.
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It isn't a question of being strict versus lenient, no funny math, and no voodoo either. The 4 and the 9 had different infractions, and the proscribed range of penalties is also different in the rule book. The 9 was illegal for rear skew, and as you mention, that is an inspection hot point... Severe penalties every time for skew violations... right out of the rule book. And post-race inspection penalties are not dependent upon finishing position.
 
For the sake of my own sanity, I'm going to take one more crack at this. Somebody said that they hope that the 9 team doesn't whine about their penalty the way the 4 team did. You said Harvick was just standing up for his team. Someone else mentioned that Harvick is kind of known for just the opposite. I agreed with that, noting that he is well known for dissing his pit crew after a bad pit stop, and has done it for years. Then it seems you were angry with me. Where did we go wrong here?
 
Formerjackman said:
For the sake of my own sanity, I'm going to take one more crack at this. Somebody said that they hope that the 9 team doesn't whine about their penalty the way the 4 team did. You said Harvick was just standing up for his team. Someone else mentioned that Harvick is kind of known for just the opposite. I agreed with that, noting that he is well known for dissing his pit crew after a bad pit stop, and has done it for years. Then it seems you were angry with me. Where did we go wrong here?
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I said that didn't have a thing to do with what happened, what Harvick did in the past. He kept himself, his team, and his organization on the front page for two weeks now. You don't like that or others also? That's fine, but I happen to believe Harvick played the press and the public.
 
LewTheShoe said:
It isn't a question of being strict versus lenient, no funny math, and no voodoo either. The 4 and the 9 had different infractions, and the proscribed range of penalties is also different in the rule book. The 9 was illegal for rear skew, and as you mention, that is an inspection hot point... Severe penalties every time for skew violations... right out of the rule book. And post-race inspection penalties are not dependent upon finishing position.
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so doing so wasn't stupid? How did that work out for Joey last year? Joey was in better shape points wise when his team tried to pull the same thing last year. At least he won the race. Elliott didn't need it after the week before. I really can't believe it was overlooked by Elliott's team. The penalties were both the same L1 infraction BTW. Harvick actually had two L1's
 
OK, finally I see what you are saying. I think it would be fair to say that I was lead off topic by replying to the comments of another person. BUT, in my defense you DID say he was standing up for his team. As for your take on the matter, I guess that IS a possibility, but considering two straight wins in dominant fashion AND getting a big penalty, how much more could they really BE on the front page?
 
StandOnIt said:
The penalties were both the same L1 infraction BTW. Harvick actually had two L1's
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Correct. All technical infractions are either L1 or L2 per the rule book. But not all L1's are the same, and not all L2's are the same. The penalty for L1 on skew is greater than an L1 for bodywork out of spec. Look, I'm done here, I just wanted to make the point that the 4 and the 9 were not busted for the same "crime."

And Jackman, I'm the guy that ragged on Harvick for crying about the Las Vegas penalty. I thought his behavior was embarrassing to himself and to SHR. I have to agree with SOI that the press seemed to eat it up, so maybe one could say Harvick played the press brilliantly... But IMO, he came off looking childish and bratty.
 
LewTheShoe said:
Correct. All technical infractions are either L1 or L2 per the rule book. But not all L1's are the same, and not all L2's are the same. The penalty for L1 on skew is greater than an L1 for bodywork out of spec. Look, I'm done here, I just wanted to make the point that the 4 and the 9 were not busted for the same "crime."

And Jackman, I'm the guy that ragged on Harvick for crying about the Las Vegas penalty. I thought his behavior was embarrassing to himself and to SHR. I have to agree with SOI that the press seemed to eat it up, so maybe one could say Harvick played the press brilliantly... But IMO, he came off looking childish and bratty.
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I agree with that assessment.
 
StandOnIt said:
They have the same fine, the same suspension, and the same points taken off for a third place finish as a team that finishes first for cheating. I know that is hard for some to figure out.
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Actually the penalty for Elliott is tougher since he didn’t win.
 
AdoubleU24 said:
25 points is nothing the way they hand out bonus points.

Losing playoff points is way worse.
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The pressure to win just ratcheted up several notches, though. It was already high coming in to this season to begin with... I shouldn't be concerned, and I'm not really with the points. The hit to reputation and perception is what is the killer with this one. Especially after they featured Chase and Alan talking about the 4's roof at Vegas on Radioactive.

Here's to hoping for a good run at California. Moving on!
 
Dr_B_UNC said:
The pressure to win just ratcheted up several notches, though. It was already high coming in to this season to begin with... I shouldn't be concerned, and I'm not really with the points. The hit to reputation and perception is what is the killer with this one. Especially after they featured Chase and Alan talking about the 4's roof at Vegas on Radioactive.

Here's to hoping for a good run at California. Moving on!
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They weren't really saying anything about the roof other than observing it under caution, I'm sure there were others talking about it too. Hell I know I woulda been.

As far as reputation goes, the tape scandal in the playoffs last year didn't tarnish it and it didn't make them any slower after. They probably got faster actually. This really is a non issue imo. If it was William Byron nobody would be talking about it.
 
AdoubleU24 said:
They weren't really saying anything about the roof other than observing it under caution, I'm sure there were others talking about it too. Hell I know I woulda been.

As far as reputation goes, the tape scandal in the playoffs last year didn't tarnish it and it didn't make them any slower after. They probably got faster actually. This really is a non issue imo. If it was William Byron nobody would be talking about it.
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that isn't true, it was viewed as a desperation move to try to even up the advantage. Putting Hamlin in the wall was the big deal.
 
StandOnIt said:
that isn't true, it was viewed as a desperation move to try to even up the advantage. Putting Hamlin in the wall was the big deal.
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But nobody was talking about it the 9 weeks of the playoffs after that when he was running up front and nearly winning every week. So based on that I don't think it tarnished anything and they don't have a reputation of being cheaters. If they do it's news to me.
 
AdoubleU24 said:
But nobody was talking about it the 9 weeks of the playoffs after that when he was running up front and nearly winning every week. So based on that I don't think it tarnished anything and they don't have a reputation of being cheaters. If they do it's news to me.
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Nobody talking about the tape issue was actually more of a testament to just how dominant the 78 team was. It was almost accepted that you had to cheat to have a shot at them. (or that cheating was justified because they were cheating, etc. I say that somewhat sarcastically btw) This very well may have been a gamble that backfired. It would be in an area that, should Chase have won, there would have been a hellacious burnout that destroyed the evidence. Instead it resulted in a third place finish which rendered it easy to find at the R&D center.
 
Damaged reputations?

If that actually happened, Chad and Jimmie would have been drummed out of the game years ago. This stuff is part of the game. I hope that never changes.
 
aunty dive said:
Damaged reputations?

If that actually happened, Chad and Jimmie would have been drummed out of the game years ago. This stuff is part of the game. I hope that never changes.
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Those appeared as two desperation moves IMO. I don't think like Harvick's that they helped or changed a thing. The end results speak for themselves. Chad and Jimmie were whipping ass. totally different IMO. I'm a fan of Elliott, but his crew is doing more harm than good.
 
StandOnIt said:
Those appeared as two desperation moves IMO. I don't think like Harvick's that they helped or changed a thing. The end results speak for themselves. Chad and Jimmie were whipping ass. totally different IMO. I'm a fan of Elliott, but his crew is doing more harm than good.
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Not very creative in the 9 shop if that's the best they can do. This infraction has been caught multiple times.

I expect more from the most penalized organization in the garage.
 
I don't understand putting the illegal setup in the car knowing you can get caught.
 
I think Chase will move on hell it might even motivate him to that first W even faster. Chad was real lucky they didn't have the new inspection process in effect when JJ was constantly winning
 
Taco said:
I don't understand putting the illegal setup in the car knowing you can get caught.
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Those pieces are in compliance pre-race. They move under load, create skew and they're supposed to move back.

Sometimes they don't. Most teams use this "cheat" and most of the time the pieces do what they're supposed to do. Not everything is checked on every car post-race ... it's a dice roll. If your car goes to R&D, you hope the housing is in the correct position.
 
They kept their car chief out west for the week. Mission accomplished.


Has Chaseroonie won a race yet?
 
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