NASCAR announces 2019 MENCS rules

ChexOrWrex said:
I dont watch a race for highlight reel moments. Moments that break a 4 hour race into a matter of seconds and disregards the mid pack action. Zero context. Theres racing for position going on through the entire field all race long whether its strategy or passing. Teams spend 350 miles calculating how to be in the best position possible for the final 50 miles.

Rating the quality of racing based on highlight reel passes is how we end up in knee jerk reaction areas like now. Not every race is going to be a classic. Not every season is going to have “game 7” type scenarios. Forcing these types of moments rather than letting any drama play out naturally is a turn off.
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I watched the leaderboard for 10 minutes during stage two at Kansas, there was one position changed, Austin Dillion up to 14th. I don't dispute the figures on the lack of passing, I watch the leaderboard every race.
 
StandOnIt said:
I watched the leaderboard for 10 minutes during stage two at Kansas, there was one position changed, Austin Dillion up to 14th
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Because tracks like Kansas suck for “entertaining passing all the time” racing but its cool if you are into watching what teams are doing for strategy, how they are planning to adjust the car, and how the drivers are compensating for information fed to them.

If you listen to Tony Stewart, theres a difference between passing and racing.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
Because tracks like Kansas suck for “entertaining passing all the time” racing but its cool if you are into watching what teams are doing for strategy, how they are planning to adjust the car, and how the drivers are compensating for information fed to them.

If you listen to Tony Stewart, theres a difference between passing and racing.
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I also don't believe it is a knee jerk reaction. The folks who collect the data from the races have tabulated the passes thru out the field, measured the reactions from fans at the track and social media and made their decision based on that data that was compiled. Not everyone is going to be pleased. And the joker in the mix is how the racing is going to be when it is tested in the real world. The test today was encouraging IMO. There wasn't one grove, passes were made on the high side and the low, one car Jones was able to pull away from the others, and one car Almirola was able to pass both of them by using the slingshot, going high and going low.
 
StandOnIt said:
I also don't believe it is a knee jerk reaction. The folks who collect the data from the races have tabulated the passes thru out the field, measured the reactions from fans at the track and social media and made their decision based on that data that was compiled. Not everyone is going to be pleased. And the joker in the mix is how the racing is going to be when it is tested in the real world. The test today was encouraging IMO. There wasn't one grove, passes were made on the high side and the low, one car Jones was able to pull away from the others, and one car Almirola was able to pass both of them by using the slingshot, going high and going low.
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That's fine and all...how come all the empty seats?
 
Seats are empty because the interest isn't there. The NFL takes precedent this time of YEAR....NASCAR will never compete with them. End the season in September.
 
Mopardh9 said:
That's fine and all...how come all the empty seats?
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doesn't pay me a dine to count them or care. My cable bill is paid and my seat is filled come race time and that is all I care about, you worrying about it is comforting though
 
StandOnIt said:
doesn't pay me a dine to count them or care. My cable bill is paid and my seat is filled come race time and that is all I care about, you worrying about it is comforting though
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Like I said...if Cup left tomorrow I wouldn't miss it, I have plenty of local tracks in the North East to keep me intetested.
 
The avid supporters of the 2019 rules cannot seem to fathom that our entertainment is a byproduct of what we like in a race which has been seen this year and last. If we want to be entertained we will go to movies or watch Netflix.

Many of us don’t care about data loops and gratuitous stats.

Some of us have a fundamental disagreement with what NASCAR is attempting next year and don’t want engineered entertainment.

If a person likes pack racing and loves monitoring passes on positions 14-17 on the leaderboard while the race is on God bless them but I want a speed contest that often times has elements of a chess game. I don’t care how many times Joey Gase and Timmy Hill pass each other in the race!!!!!!!
 
Pack racing with no off throttle response just seems.. dumb to me. I'll probably still watch. It's cool that the mid-packers and backmarkers might have a better chance, that's cool, but eh.

Fact is though, a lot of the casuals like the pack racing all the time for reasons I don't know.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
I dont watch a race for highlight reel moments. Moments that break a 4 hour race into a matter of seconds and disregards the mid pack action. Zero context. Theres racing for position going on through the entire field all race long whether its strategy or passing. Teams spend 350 miles calculating how to be in the best position possible for the final 50 miles.

Rating the quality of racing based on highlight reel passes is how we end up in knee jerk reaction areas like now. Not every race is going to be a classic. Not every season is going to have “game 7” type scenarios. Forcing these types of moments rather than letting any drama play out naturally is a turn off.
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Well said....if I wanted to watch highlight reels I wouldnt invest the time I do watching every weekend, traveling to two races each year and wearing various driver hats. The kicker for me is...with the exception of a few races this year the racing from flag go flag has been highlight reel variety through the field! Passes for the lead do nothing for me in terms of my excitement level it’s a combo of what’s happening at the front but also what’s going on through other positions. Some of the best racing we don’t see each week from tv coverage is happning in other positions, I’ll watch those highlights on Twitter or FB and think “shame we didn’t see that on TV”. From what was shown at the test it looks like a combo of drafting by holding it wide open through the turns especially turn 1 but guys were able to pull out of line and make a pass. It’ll be intresting to see if they’ll still be able to do that to complete a pass and not get hung out to dry like at Daytona or Dega. I don’t feel optimistic but Atlanta will be interesting, I wish we had what we had now but somehow maybe make the spoilers like they are on the 2019 package but give the cars more HP than this year. Also as a Chevy supporter that Ford Mustang is sexy!
 
JMO but I think the 2019 rules are designed for casuals and those that don’t appreciate the nuances of NASCAR racing. Instead of watching a race that may be played out strategically they want more of a spectacle that is weighted more toward entertainment than sport.
 
Who ever holds the bottom will have the advantage. If it's a really good car, it's going to be game over and people will change the channel.


Enjoy guys like Larson burping the throttle on the high side while you can, we only have like 1 more race where its possible.
 
DUN24 said:
Who ever holds the bottom will have the advantage. If it's a really good car, it's going to be game over and people will change the channel.
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Exactly. And I think it’s only going to get worse when teams get their hands on it and tweak after a couple weeks of racing.

High lane drivers like Larson, Jr, and at times Kyle Busch have the talent to control the throttle to help steer the car more without losing the straightaway momentum.

With no off throttle time, that talent is useless.
 
The way Harvick runs the bottom at Atlanta all damn day in the current car tells me they're gonna be pretty good next year.
 
DUN24 said:
Who ever holds the bottom will have the advantage. If it's a really good car, it's going to be game over and people will change the channel.


Enjoy guys like Larson burping the throttle on the high side while you can, we only have like 1 more race where its possible.
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Negative. The track will widen just like it does now with more time and rubber put down. They wont be able to hold the throttle wide open an entire fuel run.
 
Spotter22 said:
They wont be able to hold the throttle wide open an entire fuel run.
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If they are currently running with no or very little lift at Charlotte at a test, there is no doubt when they get to tracks like Michigan and Kansas in season they will be running WTFO all the way around.

Hell, the trucks already do and we are seeing comprable speeds.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
If they are currently running with no or very little lift at Charlotte at a test, there is no doubt when they get to tracks like Michigan and Kansas in season they will be running WTFO all the way around.

Hell, the trucks already do and we are seeing comprable speeds.
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Tell me how running full throttle around these tracks is a good thing?
 
ChexOrWrex said:
If they are currently running with no or very little lift at Charlotte at a test, there is no doubt when they get to tracks like Michigan and Kansas in season they will be running WTFO all the way around.

Hell, the trucks already do and we are seeing comprable speeds.
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It involves more then running a few laps during a test and I was specifically talking about Charlotte, not Michigan or California. Kansas should fall in to the off throttle tracks.
 
Spotter22 said:
It involves more then running a few laps during a test and I was specifically talking about Charlotte, not Michigan or California. Kansas should fall in to the off throttle tracks.
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yep I liked what I saw out of a few laps. More speed, but they could run multi grooves. Some dish the trucks? Those have been some of the more exciting races this year to watch.
 
StandOnIt said:
yep I liked what I saw out of a few laps. More speed, but they could run multi grooves. Some dish the trucks? Those have been some of the more exciting races this year to watch.
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Nobody is dishing the trucks.

What there is to “dish” is that driving in the premier auto racing series in America should be more difficult than the feeder series below it.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
'Cause pack racing results in more multi-car wrecks.
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your off the plate thing now eh? That had to be hard to let go of. Over 30 years :D A couple of the youngsters that tested said it is probably going to get spread out like the truck races when the teams get a handle on it. Can't loose the pack racing angle too. Oh well I am sure there will be something to complain about. It's Nascar.
 
StandOnIt said:
your off the plate thing now eh? That had to be hard to let go of. Over 30 years :D
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Only 23. Before 1995, I'd never heard of it. New fan, remember? :D

You didn't address my point. Do you deny that casuals like pack racing because it leads to multi-car wrecks?
 
I have no idea what a casual thinks or do I care. Wrecking is part of full body stock car racing. It sets it apart from open wheel. More side by side racing and passing is possible at the slower speeds. Saw that at the little tire test they just had. Oh yeah there is going to be some wrecking involved. That might be a good angle to complain about though, the dreaded casuals and wrecking.
 
StandOnIt said:
I have no idea what a casual thinks or do I care. Wrecking is part of full body stock car racing. It sets it apart from open wheel. More side by side racing and passing is possible at the slower speeds. Saw that at the little tire test they just had. Oh yeah there is going to be some wrecking involved. That might be a good angle to complain about though, the dreaded casuals and wrecking.
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Not complaining, just responding to AuzGrams' post.
 
I have not seen any promos for NASCAR races recently but in the past they would show wrecks. Obviously the promos are designed to capture the casuals attention so I think it is safe to say casuals like wrecks more than well established fans.

IMO truck races are really dumbed down due to the age, experience and abilities of the entrants. Making things easier for novices makes sense but to dumb things down for the top tier in the division does not make sense.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Not complaining, just responding to AuzGrams' post.
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I was ribbin ya man. For years the plate has dominated the conversation. I thought we might hold a wake for the plate.:D Maybe you could say a few words over one of them. :D The next Daytona is the last race with the plates
 
ChexOrWrex said:
If they are currently running with no or very little lift at Charlotte at a test, there is no doubt when they get to tracks like Michigan and Kansas in season they will be running WTFO all the way around.

Hell, the trucks already do and we are seeing comprable speeds.
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The truck race at Michigan this year was a barn burner, sure wasn't aero wars like the cup race there
 
There is nothing fundamentally wrong with the racing. I seriously question what someone who claims there’s been no close racing on intermediates has been watching. For the first time in a while drivers have been able to get on someone’s bumper and loosen them up. This isn’t the package of a few years ago with so much downforce and dirty air that Denny Hamlin won an ASR by driving in the middle of the track to hold off a faster Kevin Harvick.

I haven’t seen (m)any races this year where the faster cars couldn’t pass. Just some pantybunching that three teams had it figured out better than others for most of the year.
 
Snappy D said:
but guys were able to pull out of line and make a pass. It’ll be intresting to see if they’ll still be able to do that to complete a pass
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The difference here was Brad was not the leader and doing his great blocking.
I will wait for the race to see how it all plays out.
 
FLRacingFan said:
There is nothing fundamentally wrong with the racing. I seriously question what someone who claims there’s been no close racing on intermediates has been watching. For the first time in a while drivers have been able to get on someone’s bumper and loosen them up. This isn’t the package of a few years ago with so much downforce and dirty air that Denny Hamlin won an ASR by driving in the middle of the track to hold off a faster Kevin Harvick.

I haven’t seen (m)any races this year where the faster cars couldn’t pass. Just some pantybunching that three teams had it figured out better than others for most of the year.
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Exactly. This has been a really great season and everyone has shat on it.
 
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