nascar ended up with a corrupt race

Those team orders to not draft with Chevs were never confirmed. Teammtes helping teammates and manufacturers helping their own is nothing new. In fact, the battle amongst them is a big part of Nascar, IMO.

I have no doubt that MWR is guilty as charged but how far they crossed the line will likely be debated for some time to come.

I'm also waitng to hear from HMS and SHR...will they toe the Nascar line, demand reparation or have the drivers take care of it on the track?
 
#17D500winner said:
Those team orders to not draft with Chevs were never confirmed. Teammtes helping teammates and manufacturers helping their own is nothing new. In fact, the battle amongst them is a big part of Nascar, IMO.

I have no doubt that MWR is guilty as charged but how far they crossed the line will likely be debated for some time to come.

I'm also waitng to hear from HMS and SHR...will they toe the Nascar line, demand reparation or have the drivers take care of it on the track?
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Me too....they lost some big dollars there....and sponsors potential exposure.
 
#17D500winner said:
Those team orders to not draft with Chevs were never confirmed. Teammtes helping teammates and manufacturers helping their own is nothing new. In fact, the battle amongst them is a big part of Nascar, IMO.

I have no doubt that MWR is guilty as charged but how far they crossed the line will likely be debated for some time to come.

I'm also waitng to hear from HMS and SHR...will they toe the Nascar line, demand reparation or have the drivers take care of it on the track?
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I think it was Bayne being told not to draft with Gordon towards the end of the race. No big deal though, I think that was more a product of the plate package at the time than anything else. That I can live with.

My bet is HMS/SHR don't say anything until NASCAR issues further statement. There may be some stuff going on behind the scenes, though.
 
The 24 and 39 can dump the 15 and 56 in all 10 chase races if they feel it is necessary. But ya know what? Even if they do that, the 15 and 56 will still finish higher in points than the 24 and 39.
 
KevinWI said:
This is like bizarro world. This Bowyer thing just doesn't offend me at all. So weird how different people can see the exact same thing so differently.
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Almost creepy isn't it? It's like mass hallucination almost. I mean in a sport started from an illegal activity to begin with, with two of the biggest team owners ever being convicted felons, cheating as ingrained as a tick on a dogs ass and it takes THIS for the word 'corrupt' to turn up?


What the hell.
 
ToyYoda said:
The 24 and 39 can dump the 15 and 56 in all 10 chase races if they feel it is necessary. But ya know what? Even if they do that, the 15 and 56 will still finish higher in points than the 24 and 39.
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So, as far as points is concerned then they have nothing to lose by dumping them.
 
reck said:
If I remember correctly, that was due in part because Roush had team orders not to draft with chevys so the obvious thing to do is to keep them from leading and in the end it ended up causing them dearly.

This was several races before the championship became a focus point on just the two guys.

But hey, even if they did try to keep him from leading a lap at least they did it legit and the right way.

An upside to having teammates is that they can play defense for you and that is fair game but when you go the route of actually spinning and barking out orders to pit and park yourself? Well that's a whole different matter.

Childress and now Waltrip resort to this sad tactic and believe you me, if Nascar doesn't stop this now more and more teams will be doing this, its just a hard cold fact.
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So , If you tell your driver to stay out instead of pit to help a teammate its ok? Or you slow down to let him gain a position its ok, Or come down pit road and say I got a vibration its ok, Maybe even try something experimental in the last race knowing your car won't last and you will most likely never finish the race. Dude this kind of stuff has happened more than any of us will ever know. IMO you can't draw a line of black and white, right way wrong way. Just eat a snickers and enjoy life a bit more!!:D
 
reck said:
Apologies will only make things worst because you are acknowledging the problem and since NASCAR wont do anything about it it will just become an even more of a stain in the sport.

Might as well put an asterisk besides the 2013 chase. Its marred.
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Don't need no stinkin' asterisk.

As much as I think NASCAR needs to crack on MWR, 10 - 20 years from now this will make for a great trivia question.
 
MWR being dumped in the final 10 would be like A-Rod getting beamed by the pitcher. Huge positive crowd response. "You tried to make a mockery of our sport? Here's what you deserve. You don't belong here anymore so get the **** out".

 
Nothing is gonna happen. 39 might wreck some people but he also might get hung out to dry by his crew the way he threw them under the bus after Saturday's race.
 
KevinWI said:
25 points? In the new points system, that's like getting penalized 75 points in the old system. You'd (in effect) disqualify him from the championship over this?

I'd give him a 3 point penalty and tell him to be a good boy. This whole thing is overblown, in my humble opinion. Maybe it's because I'm used to watching F1 and the team orders there.
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Yes, IMO that's exactly what needs to be done.

If not 25 points, then at least enough to make it damn near impossible for Bowyer to win the championship.
 
Cholo said:
Nothing is gonna happen. 39 might wreck some people but he also might get hung out to dry by his crew the way he threw them under the bus after Saturday's race.
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I can imagine Newman's jackman stopping to tie his shoe during a pit stop.

"A 25.3 second stop ? Jeez, sorry Ryan. Can't you make that up on the track ?"
 
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BamaFan said:
So , If you tell your driver to stay out instead of pit to help a teammate its ok? Or you slow down to let him gain a position its ok, Or come down pit road and say I got a vibration its ok, Maybe even try something experimental in the last race knowing your car won't last and you will most likely never finish the race. Dude this kind of stuff has happened more than any of us will ever know. IMO you can't draw a line of black and white, right way wrong way. Just eat a snickers and enjoy life a bit more!!:D
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Everything you mention is done pretty much under the radar.

What MWR did was so over the top that, well, we're still talkin' about it.

Snickers for breakfast. I gotta try that . . .
 
Section 1-6: "The NASCAR Rules are intended to ensure that NASCAR sanctioned Events are conducted in a manner that is as fair as possible for all Competitors, consistent with prompt finality in competition results. ...''

Portion of Section 3-1 on Eligibility to be in NASCAR: "... NASCAR is dedicated to the highest degree of professionalism, sportsmanship and integrity in stock car racing. ...''

Section: 12-1 General Procedure: "If a NASCAR Official or Supervisory Official observes or is made aware of an act or omission by a NASCAR Member that constitutes a violation of the NASCAR Rules or that is detrimental to stock car racing or NASCAR, and if the NASCAR Official or Supervisory Official determines that the act or omission is sufficiently serious to warrant the imposition of a penalty, the Official shall report the violation in written detail to the NASCAR Vice President of Competition as soon as practicable, and shall recommend an appropriate penalty. ...''

Section: 12-4 General Scope of Penalties – "Penalties for violation of NASCAR Rules are determined by the gravity of the violation and its effect on fairness of competition, the orderly conduct of the Event, and the interests of stock car racing and NASCAR. Such penalties may include, but are not limited to a fine, and/or disqualification, and/or loss of Championship points, and/or loss of finishing position(s) in the Event, and/or probation, and/or suspension of membership or license privileges. ...''

Item 32 on NASCAR National Series Penalty Card given to each crew chief: "Intentionally causing a caution: When a car/driver in the judgment of NASCAR Officials intentionally causes a caution.'' Penalty for this is listed as "NASCAR discretion.''
 
Matthew2470 said:
Section 1-6: "The NASCAR Rules are intended to ensure that NASCAR sanctioned Events are conducted in a manner that is as fair as possible for all Competitors, consistent with prompt finality in competition results. ...''

Portion of Section 3-1 on Eligibility to be in NASCAR: "... NASCAR is dedicated to the highest degree of professionalism, sportsmanship and integrity in stock car racing. ...''

Section: 12-1 General Procedure: "If a NASCAR Official or Supervisory Official observes or is made aware of an act or omission by a NASCAR Member that constitutes a violation of the NASCAR Rules or that is detrimental to stock car racing or NASCAR, and if the NASCAR Official or Supervisory Official determines that the act or omission is sufficiently serious to warrant the imposition of a penalty, the Official shall report the violation in written detail to the NASCAR Vice President of Competition as soon as practicable, and shall recommend an appropriate penalty. ...''

Section: 12-4 General Scope of Penalties – "Penalties for violation of NASCAR Rules are determined by the gravity of the violation and its effect on fairness of competition, the orderly conduct of the Event, and the interests of stock car racing and NASCAR. Such penalties may include, but are not limited to a fine, and/or disqualification, and/or loss of Championship points, and/or loss of finishing position(s) in the Event, and/or probation, and/or suspension of membership or license privileges. ...''

Item 32 on NASCAR National Series Penalty Card given to each crew chief: "Intentionally causing a caution: When a car/driver in the judgment of NASCAR Officials intentionally causes a caution.'' Penalty for this is listed as "NASCAR discretion.''
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Item 32. 'Nuff said.
 
I would predict probably a 25 pt. penalty for the 15 team and fines for the 15 and 55. I don't think Truex will be dinged nor should he be, even though he was a beneficiary he wasn't an active participant.
 
I'm sure MWR thought this would blow over. It's Monday and still being talked about by the people in Nascar. It's not blowing over anytime soon. Also, Clint still hasn't said a word. If it's enough to make him of all people stop talking, it's pretty big LOL
 
Looks like MWR is in a Twitter lockdown since Saturday night. Mikey & Clint are unusually silent on social media these days.

Darrell on the other hand.....

Darrell Waltrip@AllWaltrip
it takes a genius to figure out if Bowyer spins, 55 pits, the 99 jumps the restart and the 39 doesn't win, 56 makes chase on a tie breaker!
 
dpkimmel2001 said:
Looks like MWR is in a Twitter lockdown since Saturday night. Mikey & Clint are unusually silent on social media these days.

Darrell on the other hand.....

Darrell Waltrip@AllWaltrip
it takes a genius to figure out if Bowyer spins, 55 pits, the 99 jumps the restart and the 39 doesn't win, 56 makes chase on a tie breaker!
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Gee, imagine that. DW backs both his brother AND NASCAR. Shocker!
 
dpkimmel2001 said:
Looks like MWR is in a Twitter lockdown since Saturday night. Mikey & Clint are unusually silent on social media these days.

Darrell on the other hand.....

Darrell Waltrip@AllWaltrip
it takes a genius to figure out if Bowyer spins, 55 pits, the 99 jumps the restart and the 39 doesn't win, 56 makes chase on a tie breaker!
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As usual his spin on his brothers obvious cheating is laughable but you really cant blame him for trying as he's said in the past "He's my brother and family is family so you do what you can do".
 
dpkimmel2001 said:
Looks like MWR is in a Twitter lockdown since Saturday night. Mikey & Clint are unusually silent on social media these days.

Darrell on the other hand.....

Darrell Waltrip@AllWaltrip
it takes a genius to figure out if Bowyer spins, 55 pits, the 99 jumps the restart and the 39 doesn't win, 56 makes chase on a tie breaker!
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An incredibly weak attempt at plausible denial.

Better to remain silent and be thought a fool . . .
 
dpkimmel2001 said:
Looks like MWR is in a Twitter lockdown since Saturday night. Mikey & Clint are unusually silent on social media these days.

Darrell on the other hand.....

Darrell Waltrip@AllWaltrip
it takes a genius to figure out if Bowyer spins, 55 pits, the 99 jumps the restart and the 39 doesn't win, 56 makes chase on a tie breaker!
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I'm a Clint Bowyer fan and have had some dissenting opinions on this whole thing, but there's not a doubt in my mind that the 15 spin and 55 slowdown were intentional. Not since the last Ocean's Eleven movie have I seen a heist so beautifully orchestrated. It's like Bowyer and Vickers were George Clooney and Brad Pitt, and Jeff Gordon was Andy Garcia.
 
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KevinWI said:
This is like bizarro world. This Bowyer thing just doesn't offend me at all. So weird how different people can see the exact same thing so differently.
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it pisses me off because it cheapens the chase. whether you are a newman or gordon fan or not they were on their way to earn their spots. Newman drove his ass off at the end of the richmond race to be on his way to grab his second victory and a wildcard. Bowyer and MWR STOLE that from him. Gordon came back from a horrible race to put himself in position for 10th. Again Bowyer, MWR, and now Vickers stole that from him by manipulating where Logano finished. Sorry, but Logano and Truex didnt earn their spots.
 
Cholo said:
Nothing is gonna happen. 39 might wreck some people but he also might get hung out to dry by his crew the way he threw them under the bus after Saturday's race.
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if they didnt feel the same way after that performance then they deserved to get thrown under that bus and backed over repeatedly.
 
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