What Do you Think of the New Package?

ChexOrWrex said:
Its the shape of the sides of the cars. First step is to mandate that both sides be symmetrical and we’d be getting somewhere.
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There are several things to do *if* the goal is to slash side force... side-to-side symmetry, smaller quarter panels, and deleting the "dorsal fin" or whatever it's called. Less side force would reduce cornering speeds, and thus create more off-throttle time. But the current philosophy of Nascar doesn't want more off-throttle time... quite the opposite... the current goal is WFO cornering to promote pack racing.

Racing nirvana for me would be... 2018 horsepower and downforce, plus sharply reduced side force... followed by an extended period of relative stability in aero rules to allow all the major teams to get their act together. My theory is, we got to this drafting package because HMS and Penske lagged behind in development in 2018. That allowed the 18 and 4 cars to dominate things for two thirds of the year... and the fans revolted... which led to Nascar's philosophical about-face for 2019.
 
I was happy with the 2018 season, but I am pretty happy with what I have seen so far. The 17 held the 19 up once again at Vegas when the 19 was clearly the fastest car, yet once again I guess they, the 19 did not have the fastest driver, or the new package is evening things out some. To be fair the 19 might have a winning driver and crew chief combo, but they have to gel a little more with the rest of the team and working under the JGR roof. Not the same as Denver.

I think it's the package and the package is working.
 
Spotter22 said:
They arent????
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Thats a joke right? I thought you were omniscient. These cars havent been symmetrical for years. The 2019 cars are no different.

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The thing that keeps me from getting too invested is that all of this is subject to change when the Gen 7 arrives. This season and next is a test session for that car. You know NASCAR will keep fiddling with the rules until they find something they like. Wouldn't be surprised at all if the All-Star race this year has a new aero package like it did last year. Fine by me as long as they pick something and stick to it. Like others have said previously, you have to give the teams time to adjust to the rules. Changing them every season is detrimental.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
These cars havent been symmetrical for years.
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I assume the inspection process allows for asymmetrical bodies. I wonder how a symmetrical design would work. The drivers like to use the left rear of a car to side draft and it makes me think that corner of the car is less stable.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
Thats a joke right? I thought you were omniscient. These cars havent been symmetrical for years. The 2019 cars are no different.

0dnVSQZcjUjJt20KkLeDrZQbJOph7wSXOebqAGMD63I.jpg
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These cars are exactly the same minus the nose. Exactly! Thats the reason for the OSS to begin with. Parity!
 
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Spotter22 said:
lol. Unreal I dont know where the hell you've been but these cars are exactly the same minus the nose. Exactly! Thats the reason for the OSS to begin with. Parity!
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Symmetry means the same on both sides. The left side of the car is not the same as the right side.
 
Spotter22 said:
These cars are exactly the same minus the nose. Exactly! Thats the reason for the OSS to begin with. Parity!
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We're not talking about parity, we're talking about symmetry. The right side of the car is flatter than the left / the left side curves out more than the right.
 
When has Kenseth drove a Joe Gibbs car? I don't think the newer forms of inspection were around then. Last year was the first time the OSS tent inspection was used
 
Charlie Spencer said:
We're not talking about parity, we're talking about symmetry. The right side of the car is flatter than the left / the left side curves out more than the right.
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The shelfs are the same on all cars. Might be the wrap, angle of the shot, and cars we are looking that dont even run anymore.
 
ReturnTrip said:
The thing that keeps me from getting too invested is that all of this is subject to change when the Gen 7 arrives. This season and next is a test session for that car. You know NASCAR will keep fiddling with the rules until they find something they like. Wouldn't be surprised at all if the All-Star race this year has a new aero package like it did last year. Fine by me as long as they pick something and stick to it. Like others have said previously, you have to give the teams time to adjust to the rules. Changing them every season is detrimental.
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I would throw different aero rules on the fly. Stops the advantage of testing the major money teams have.
 
Turtle84 said:
I would love to see the list of driver's NASCAR talked to that were onboard or advocating for this package change
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Lets be honest here, the top 5 in points don't want changes and those fro 15 on back are praying the changes will help them.
 
LewTheShoe said:
My theory is, we got to this drafting package because HMS and Penske lagged behind in development in 2018. That allowed the 18 and 4 cars to dominate things for two thirds of the year... and the fans revolted... which led to Nascar's philosophical about-face for 2019
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Changes were in the works long before this and although HMS didn't do well, ( common opinion is their problems are internal), I don't think Ford or Penske were complaining.
 
SlicedBread22 said:
I'd have to put the 18 behind the 22 there.. not early but he had plenty of time to get up there and I wont accept that "cant pass people" crap he was spewing.. Joey and Brad could pass people fine all day because they had the best cars. Kyle was fast but he has to be able to pass people up front to be considered up there with the Penske guys. They were fast all day and could.pass cars when they caught them. I think that is the deciding factor
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Kyle passed people all day. He lost because he screwed up on pit road. He was better than the Penskes, but that's cool. Joey and Kez ran a great race.
 
SlicedBread22 said:
I'm actually VERY curious about that as well.

Personally I have never had a problem with the racing that I can attribute to the way the cars are governed. Sure there have been some boring races and nobody likes seeing someone beat their driver by 10 seconds but that stuff happens.

..but as I've only really followed NASCAR for the past decade I never saw what the racing was like back then that makes people hate the racing so much now.

I've seen plenty of exciting races. It must have been crazy 3 wide every turn, lead changing every other lap, grit your teeth and floor it last man standing wins the race type of sh!t for so many of you guys to have such an issue with todays racing and actually be able to justify that to yourselves.

It had to have been like that every week or there's no way people would carry on like they do now.
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I liked the racing last year and felt the best teams and drivers were rewarded under those rules. Unfortunately for me Nascar had a brutal year in 2018 so what we have now is momentum racing with cars suctioned to the track.

IDK who all the people complaining about this new form of racing are as all I see is what is posted here. It seems as some people like it, some are warming up to it and others are on the fence. Of course there are people that don’t like anything but there are those that like anything and they usually balance each other out.

I know this current style of racing has done nothing for me and I don’t think that will change. Of course I will need more time to make up my mind and see what changes Nascar makes. If these new rules attract a younger demographic then the operation is a success. If not it is just rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic.
 
Revman said:
Kyle passed people all day. He lost because he screwed up on pit road. He was better than the Penskes, but that's cool. Joey and Kez ran a great race.
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That went a long way toward his losing, but it is hard to predict that was his only problem or anybodies elses, a lot of cars faded in the later stages of the race. Without any history of this new package, I think each time the teams come to a track there is a bit of guessing involved until they get more data. Both of the Penske cars qualified back in the field, but were good in the closing laps and 4 cars were good after a 100 lap run to battle for the lead, but it really was a two car race in the closing laps. At least it wasn't a car out front just running hard enough to stay out front in clean air. I think that is why most fans liked the race. Plenty of action the whole time.
 
Revman said:
Kyle passed people all day. He lost because he screwed up on pit road. He was better than the Penskes, but that's cool. Joey and Kez ran a great race.
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I disagree.

:cheers:

Edit: Okay I'll elaborate.. he had what? Half the race after that penalty to get through the field? I think he was a third place car.. otherwise he would have been able to pass Harvick earlier and make a run at them. He may have been catching them but they were battling back and forth so you cant really take much stake in that.

Even early in the race when Harvick had a 4 second lead Joey was faster.. Brad had the better car at the end but not by much.
 
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Acs said:
The thing I never hear from the haters is a viable alternative to what we got, only more whining. If you have a magic solution to make the 1.5ers race like the "good ol' days", whatever that means, I'm sure NASCAR is all ears. But realize that at the very least NASCAR has constantly been trying nearly everything over the last 5 years to find that package that will please everyone.

To recap everything that's been thrown at the wall:
High HP / high downforce / high drag = 2014 rules package
High HP / Low downforce / low drag = 2016-18 rules
High HP / Low Downforce / high drag = 2015 Indy and Michigan experiment
Low HP / high downforce / high drag = 2019 rules
Low HP/ low downforce / low drag = 2015-18 superspeedway package

So tell me, what's the winning combination here?
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Should have kept the 2015 Indy and Michigan package.
 
Yup. Seen enough, this weekend seals it for me. It's time to start removing the gimmicks NASCAR!
 
I wonder how Danica would have done in the current underpowered/heavy downforce package?
 
I’ll give NASCAR credit for giving it a shot. But this package is straight doo doo. Back to the drawing board.
 
I thought that it would be good but not sure anymore.
Did anyone check Kyle's restriction plate?
 
Yeah these air ducts do not help at all. Should just remove them and go with the Atlanta package, that was a terrific race
 
Just a reminder this package is already the basis for the next gen car (not gonna find the url/article). They ain't changing nothing.

What a clusterf. Good thing we have Martinsville this week. The mid-summer stretch this year will be b-r-u-t-a-l if the racing is similar to what today produced.
 
Speedbowl14 said:
Just a reminder this package is already the basis for the next gen car (not gonna find the url/article). They ain't changing nothing.

What a clusterf. Good thing we have Martinsville this week. The mid-summer stretch this year will be b-r-u-t-a-l if the racing is similar to what today produced.
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I can't completely blame the package though. Bottom line is Penske and Gibbs are way better than the field right now which is leading to the lack of parity. People say it's difficult to drive thru the field, yet these guys are doing just that regularly
 
Mispeedway15 said:
I can't completely blame the package though. Bottom line is Penske and Gibbs are way better than the field right now which is leading to the lack of parity. People say it's difficult to drive thru the field, yet these guys are doing just that regularly
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Yep...here's the problem...no such thing as braking anymore for the turns so no reason to invest in that. Can't make up time on pit road with common guns. The penalties for being caught cheating and pushing the "grey area" are absurd (and loved by the fans for some reason?) so you can't risk a penalty.

So how do the rest of the teams catch up? They can't. I'm expecting the Penske/Gibbs show this year at the big tracks.
 
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