NASCAR Death Bed

StandOnIt said:
The GM teams seemed to switch brands every year to whatever Pontiac, Olds, Buick, or Chevy was the slipperiest. The 90's on up was when all you heard was aero tight or aero loose, then the twisted sisters. People wern't around then or how soon they forget.
Click to expand...
How soon You forget what it was like having different manufacturers pissing and moaning about spoiler heights...ahh the good days
 
Formerjackman said:
Probably not a good time to get in a public pissing contest with somebody you have to rely on to even get a car on the track every week.
Click to expand...

I'm going to worry about pissing off a guy who just ran my business into the ground? Yeah, you can trust him if you don't. Come on man, that doesn't even make sense. Wonder what it looked like when JGR wanted access to Cole's set ups. :idunno: What if FRR got an advantage because they could refine the JGR chassis, and refused to share? Wonder if that would change the opinions, speculation, etc. That probably is more realistic than some 300% price increase IMO....I mean, if we are going to blow smoke out of our backsides.
 
Last edited:
Mopardh9 said:
Texas can't even draw 15k for an Xfinity race, what makes you think they would draw that much in Utah?
Click to expand...

A track with a decent amount of promoting would be able to get around 20,000-25,000 I'd think for their first race. Road courses have done quite well for attendance. It's a market NASCAR has never been to.
 
10-4 said:
There was some good racing back then but a majority of the races were snooze fests. They were nowhere near as competitive as what we have now. Stages improved racing a 110%. One of the worst things back then the Chevy people would whine the Fords had an unfair advantage so Nascar would make changes what seemed like every other week. Or vice versa. That was crazy. Yeah there was a lot of questionable stuff back then it is a wonder anyone thinks those were the days. Much better now. If you don't really like it so much you can always turn the channel. That's what I did when I lost interest.
Click to expand...

If you believe it that's all that matters.

I have no idea what era 'back then' is so I can't really make an argument.

Some people try to pull fast ones and dredge up numbers from the 70s and 80s to prove a point about competition. Nobody is arguing that was the competitive Golden Era of NASCAR, but I sure as hell don't agree that era happening right now.
 
Revman said:
I'm going to worry about pissing off a guy who just ran my business into the ground?
Click to expand...

If you want to get anything positive out of your final three months as a car owner you might.


Revman said:
Come on man, that doesn't even make sense. Wonder what it looked like when JGR wanted access to Cole's set ups. :idunno: What if FRR got an advantage because they could refine the JGR chassis, and refused to share? Wonder if that would change the opinions, speculation, etc.
Click to expand...

There has been speculation that Pearn was not very forthcoming about information, and that MIGHT me correct and MIGHT be a source of friction. If true, the remedy for JGR is to give proper notice (Perhaps at the BEGINING of the season like SHR did with HMS) and give Furniture Row time to put something new together, not stick it to them so late in the season.

Revman said:
That probably is more realistic than some 300% price increase IMO....I mean, if we are going to blow smoke out of our backsides.
Click to expand...

My guess is the price increase was designed to force FRR out of the alliance without actually having to do what I said above, and tell the world they no longer want to do business with Furniture Row. I have no problem with JGR wanting to cuts ties, that's their prerogative, what I object to is the timing. Again NOBODY has denied a major price increase on either side. Visser said it wasn't why he was quitting, not that it wasn't true. If you think it's all made up, take it up with allenbaba, who knows more about it than both of us combined.
 
No matter how many posts that I see that tout today's racing over racing back in the day, I'm never going to be convinced that racing is better in today's Nascar. Different yeah, I'll give you that. I sat on waiting lists for years back in the day to get my season tickets to some tracks and it sure as heck wan't because fans were watching subpar races. Different era's, different form of racing. It's all good.
 
I think the relevant question is why do certain tracks seem to have much better success selling tickets, and what can the other tracks learn from it?
 
StandOnIt said:
The GM teams seemed to switch brands every year to whatever Pontiac, Olds, Buick, or Chevy was the slipperiest. The 90's on up was when all you heard was aero tight or aero loose, then the twisted sisters. People wern't around then or how soon they forget.
Click to expand...
Geebus, during the better part of the 90's, it seem like every week one of the manufacturers was complaining about something or another manufacturer had an aero advantaged the prior race. I dont miss those days TBH( I do actually miss those days, and the 90's as a decade, but not for that one thing from that era.)
 
Formerjackman said:
I think the relevant question is why do certain tracks seem to have much better success selling tickets, and what can the other tracks learn from it?
Click to expand...
Because they’re 1 mile or less in length or they’re Super Speedways.

Learnin’ isn’t going to fix that.
 
aunty dive said:
Our “local” track. I’ve been there a lot.

Phoenix has always been a hot-bed of racing.
Click to expand...

I went down there twice when the fall NASCAR dates coincided with the USAC sprint races at the now defunct Manzanita Speedway. One year it was rainy and nobody could believe it. Great track and fans.
 
A sellout is a sellout.

If you can’t sell them all, you have too many seats.
 
gnomesayin said:
I went down there twice when the fall NASCAR dates coincided with the USAC sprint races at the now defunct Manzanita Speedway. One year it was rainy and nobody could believe it. Great track and fans.
Click to expand...
It is.

We ran cars in The Copper Cup for a few years. It seems like a long time ago because it was. :cool: Always went to Manzanita to watch the sprint cars.
 
FLRacingFan said:
If Texas (or any other intermediate that you, average race fan, hate) had only 45,000 seats they'd be selling out all the time too.
Click to expand...

Yeah is this really surprising to anyone? Phoenix was already a popular ticket and they reduced the seating capacity with this renovation from 60k to 45k so...

Hell if tracks could only fit 45k we'd have sellouts at Daytona, Talledaga, Bristol, Charlotte, Kansas, Las Vegas, New Hampshire, Dover, Pocono, Atlanta...I could go on and on :D
 
aunty dive said:
A sellout is a sellout.

If you can’t sell them all, you have too many seats.
Click to expand...
There are several (many?) that should have more seats removed but I find it hypocritical that a 90k track that’s two-thirds full gets raked over the coals while a 45k venue that sells out three days before the event is lauded. Phoenix is just playing the optics game better.

This isn’t really directed at anyone here but the thousands of people you see complaining all the time on Twitter, reddit, Facebook, etc.
 
FLRacingFan said:
There are several (many?) that should have more seats removed but I find it hypocritical that a 90k track that’s two-thirds full gets raked over the coals while a 45k venue that sells out three days before the event is lauded. Phoenix is just playing the optics game better.

This isn’t really directed at anyone here but the thousands of people you see complaining all the time on Twitter, reddit, Facebook, etc.
Click to expand...

I agree there's a lot of seat hippocracy...like if Bristol removed seats and was de-Colosseumed the ensuing uproar would be deafening.
 
FLRacingFan said:
There are several (many?) that should have more seats removed but I find it hypocritical that a 90k track that’s two-thirds full gets raked over the coals while a 45k venue that sells out three days before the event is lauded. Phoenix is just playing the optics game better.

This isn’t really directed at anyone here but the thousands of people you see complaining all the time on Twitter, reddit, Facebook, etc.
Click to expand...

Phoenix doesn't have 45,000 seats FYI. sold out and selling standing room only. That's a tough one for the deathbedders to count those I bet.
 
FLRacingFan said:
There are several (many?) that should have more seats removed but I find it hypocritical that a 90k track that’s two-thirds full gets raked over the coals while a 45k venue that sells out three days before the event is lauded. Phoenix is just playing the optics game better.

This isn’t really directed at anyone here but the thousands of people you see complaining all the time on Twitter, reddit, Facebook, etc.
Click to expand...

Playing the optics game has some value. Thousands of empty seats, whether there are 150,000 seats or 50,000 seats sends a message, and it isn't a good one.
 
What a year it has been for NASCAR. The 4 Team caught cheating twice. The leader of the sport involved in a traffic stop that became national news. The 48 sent to the back of the pack for not violating a rule. NASCAR publishes the wrong results on the pole at the track and on their website. Unfilled seats/stands galore during the playoff races. Spencer Gallagher’s issue after his win. Ratings that continue to nosedive. Fanatics balling out of their at the track activities. The 78 Team disbanding after they won a championship.

Can’t wait to see what the next 2 weeks will bring.

All of the above makes me wonder if NASCAR’s brass is hoping to move onto next year as quickly as possible due to the train wreck of a season it has been so far.
 
Last edited:
From what I read here lately, we'll probably be lucky if Nascar even comes back in 2019. Oh well, looks like a lot more free Sundays. Maybe I can get started next Spring on that new garden the wife wants tilled?

I listen to sport talk radio most all day, every day here in the Pittsburgh, PA market. Outside of possibly who wins the Daytona 500, the sport isn't talked about. They don't talk about drivers getting caught cheating, empty seats, Nascar enforced penalties, etc.... Even in Nascar's glory days, it just wasn't a topic of conversation outside the Nascar Community. People round these parts don't care about what makes the news in our sport because they never hear about it.
 
Formerjackman said:
Playing the optics game has some value. Thousands of empty seats, whether there are 150,000 seats or 50,000 seats sends a message, and it isn't a good one.
Click to expand...

I don't think the average fan that watches racing is that obsessed with looking at the stands but they ARE obsessed with the racing. It does create a parasitic drain as some will use that for any excuse to justify their point. It is the downside of the social media. It is getting better around here as those type of posts are being isolated to a couple of threads that don't have anything to do with the racing instead of cluttering up the other threads where members are trying to talk about the racing.
 
I think the average race fan notices the empty seats and is concerned about it. I think the average NASCAR fan is concerned about it too as they know the sport is in trouble, isn't doing much to address the situation, or what they have done hasn't stopped the flow of people dismissing the sport or loosing interest in it.

Nothing like chatting about the hard racing for 17th place or 26th place when the leader hit clean air and can't be passed or something else is going on with that car to provide an advantage that the other cars in the field don't have so they can't pass. Yep, it was the driver's style of driving that allowed him to win that there race.
 
dpkimmel2001 said:
From what I read here lately, we'll probably be lucky if Nascar even comes back in 2019. Oh well, looks like a lot more free Sundays. Maybe I can get started next Spring on that new garden the wife wants tilled?

I listen to sport talk radio most all day, every day here in the Pittsburgh, PA market. Outside of possibly who wins the Daytona 500, the sport isn't talked about. They don't talk about drivers getting caught cheating, empty seats, Nascar enforced penalties, etc.... Even in Nascar's glory days, it just wasn't a topic of conversation outside the Nascar Community. People round these parts don't care about what makes the news in our sport because they never hear about it.
Click to expand...

Sports talk radio stopped chatting about NASCAR when it started to fail to stimulate conversation.

Your post makes it appear that NASCAR is a niche sport and not a major sport. That confuses me. Is it a major sport or a niche sport?
 
Towmater said:
Sports talk radio stopped chatting about NASCAR when it started to fail to stimulate conversation.

Your post makes it appear that NASCAR is a niche sport and not a major sport. That confuses me. Is it a major sport or a niche sport?
Click to expand...
I don't concern myself with defining the sport. I simply watch it because I find it entertaining. How it's viewed by anyone else really doesn't matter to me. If I get to the point where I'm no longer entertained, I'll move on to other things. .
 
aunty dive said:
As I grow older, I place a much higher value on my time.

I can’t imagine spending any of it on a negative daily assault of anything sports or entertainment relatated. Flip the channel.
Click to expand...
Value of time..... Ain't that the truth? Worrying about things outside of our control is certainly a waste of effort.

I could sit here and complain about empty seats at a Nascar venue but if I do that from the comfort of my own home on a Sunday afternoon, how legitimate is my argument? I may not be happy to hear about a decline in ratings but I do my part when I tune in. Not a lot more that I can do about it other than that.

There are things that I really like about this sport and others that I equally dislike. I think I can say the same for every sport that I watch, and that's a lot of them.
 
most deathbedders have a misshapen way of looking at the sport although that will be denied vigorously usually using the "they are concerned" excuse. They can't explain how Nascar as a whole continues to make money for the stockholders and pay dividends, why ISC and Speedway have been spending tremendous amounts of money in track renovations, reconfiguration's, upkeep and improvements to the infrastructure. They are blissfully ignorant about the various revenue streams that continue to keep the sport profitable, funded and out of the taxpayers pocket for the years to come. I don't complain about empty seats, I choose not to go to races anymore, I feel I have a better seat at the house all things considered. I notice that those doing all the complaining don't go to races, most don't even watch the races if that makes any sense and it really doesn't, and those that continue to criticize (all for the sports good) the sport work diligently to try to convince us that a trouble is a brewing, flying in the face or facts and figures to the contrary. But that is the why they are really here for so they do have a purpose. Two more races to go until the dark period, I am going to enjoy the hell out of them. you?
 
StandOnIt said:
most deathbedders have a misshapen way of looking at the sport although that will be denied vigorously usually using the "they are concerned" excuse. They can't explain how Nascar as a whole continues to make money for the stockholders and pay dividends, why ISC and Speedway have been spending tremendous amounts of money in track renovations, reconfiguration's, upkeep and improvements to the infrastructure. They are blissfully ignorant about the various revenue streams that continue to keep the sport profitable, funded and out of the taxpayers pocket for the years to come. I don't complain about empty seats, I choose not to go to races anymore, I feel I have a better seat at the house all things considered. I notice that those doing all the complaining don't go to races, most don't even watch the races if that makes any sense and it really doesn't, and those that continue to criticize (all for the sports good) the sport work diligently to try to convince us that a trouble is a brewing, flying in the face or facts and figures to the contrary. But that is the why they are really here for so they do have a purpose. Two more races to go until the dark period, I am going to enjoy the hell out of them. you?
Click to expand...
Dark period..... Oh how I wish for a Chase wining car to have a L1 rules infraction found @ the R&D Center on Monday, November 19th.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom