2021 Silly Season

Formerjackman

Team Owner
Joined
Aug 15, 2017
Messages
3,567
Points
343
Would be cool to see the 4th car be a part time allstar car.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
Well, if you had the budget to do THAT, you would be better off to run one driver all year and run for the championship. It could be fun, but I don't know that it makes much sense financially.
 

LewTheShoe

Team Owner
Joined
Apr 21, 2016
Messages
3,901
Points
493
Here is a good one for this thread

I posted last summer, when Nationwide Insurance announced their departure from the 88, that it wouldn't surprise me to see this happen... Bowman getting the Ally Financial sponsorship after Jimmie retires. I still hope it doesn't happen 'cause I'd hate to see the loss of another top-shelf car from the grid.
 

FLRacingFan

Team Owner
Joined
Feb 9, 2013
Messages
25,819
Points
883
Location
Florida
Makes sense with most of the #88’s inventory being filled by Chevy accessory partners. Never is good to see a quality seat disappear, but it would make sense in context and maybe a little contraction will be worthwhile for HMS. Besides Brad there isn’t really anyone of high caliber available and it sounds like he really wants an extension with Penske. They already are a very young team as well, so they may want to shy away from those types of drivers for now.

It would make the market tougher for someone like Bell or Jones depending on how JGR/LFR/TRD want to proceed.
 

Team Penske

Team Owner
Joined
Jan 16, 2015
Messages
6,326
Points
643
I like the idea of closing the 88 and moving Bowman to the #48.
The 88 was created to make a home for the #8 Junior team.
 

AdoubleU24

Team Owner
Joined
Mar 9, 2015
Messages
4,805
Points
593
I actually like this move versus adding yet another young guy. Also makes me wonder if they already know that Brad is off the table.

There's nobody in Xfinity worthy of that seat that's currently in a Chevy imo, and Erik Jones just feels like a weird fit to me.

I will say it's a bit concerning that Bowman still isn't able to secure his own sponsorship as a winning playoff driver.
 

Revman

KFB
Joined
Jan 12, 2014
Messages
8,989
Points
793
Toyota changed the model to franchising teams like a McDonnell's franchise. All about their mother ship factory TRD and the middleman Gibbs. They set Barney up with cars, drivers, pit crews. Did the same for Leavine. Both are quitting by what they say are rising "expenses". Ya can't have it both ways, the Hendricks, SHR Childress's Ganassi's are all independent businesses they can run any brand they want to run. None of the other OEM's went out and "set up" puppet race teams who are controlled by them, run who they want, even bench pit crews on their franchise teams when they don't let the mother ship team win a race except Toyota. So whenever one of them fails it is because they have the rug ripped out from under them. They gutted Barney and they are gutting Leavine. I'm sure you won't agree, but many of us see it that way.
Yup, they sure changed the model from writing a check to actually participating in the sport. Gibbs took a hell of a risk on Toyota....and initially it wasn't a good one. Economics changed the way JGR and Toyota did business when TRD became the builder. They built this thing because nobody else wanted to be in a Toyota. Now, you cry because it worked. Why in the hell would Toyota run Leavine and Barney dry? How would that serve them? They helped, but then, as the NASCAR community would want it, it was up to them to get funding to continue their upward trend. You may not have noticed, but the economics have been pretty tough for a few years in this sport, and COVID is the final nail. Would you prefer that Toyota brand Leavine as "Toyota Racing" and fund it from start to finish?

You will never get over the Cowboy incident at Indy, but that's fine. Everybody has always known that these satellite teams are a fancy way of circumventing the four car rule.

Toyota showed this sport huge respect on entry, and it poured money into it when the economy went south. Can you image a series with just two manufacturers? .....Well, you might like that because spec is okay too, right? Toyota will not participate in anything unless there is something in it for them, and I don't blame them. Chevy and Ford have to compete now. Chevy not so great at this apparently while Ford has stepped up. This has only become a problem because of recent success, and anti-Toyota bias. You will get over it. Ford is likely to win the Manufacturers Championship, and I wonder if Denny has the balls to go head to head with Harvick in Phoenix. I just love that OUR performance has improved. That TRD group is a sassy bunch.
 

ahhculdee

Team Owner
Joined
Jul 10, 2017
Messages
229
Points
123
I really don't see that happening with how many free agents are out there. Smells like some BS.
 

Team Penske

Team Owner
Joined
Jan 16, 2015
Messages
6,326
Points
643
Also I really believe 4 car team rule should be lifted.
So what numbers would you like to see?
HMS, 10 cars.
JGR, 10 cars
Penske 10 cars
For a 30 car field times 30 races per year.??????
BTW the reason I don't mention SHR is they don't seem to be able to find sponsors for 4 cars never mind 8.
 

HoopsMcCann

Jackman
New Member!
Joined
Jul 20, 2020
Messages
74
Points
18
Location
Southwest Michigan
Yup, they sure changed the model from writing a check to actually participating in the sport. Gibbs took a hell of a risk on Toyota....and initially it wasn't a good one. Economics changed the way JGR and Toyota did business when TRD became the builder. They built this thing because nobody else wanted to be in a Toyota. Now, you cry because it worked. Why in the hell would Toyota run Leavine and Barney dry? How would that serve them? They helped, but then, as the NASCAR community would want it, it was up to them to get funding to continue their upward trend. You may not have noticed, but the economics have been pretty tough for a few years in this sport, and COVID is the final nail. Would you prefer that Toyota brand Leavine as "Toyota Racing" and fund it from start to finish?

You will never get over the Cowboy incident at Indy, but that's fine. Everybody has always known that these satellite teams are a fancy way of circumventing the four car rule.

Toyota showed this sport huge respect on entry, and it poured money into it when the economy went south. Can you image a series with just two manufacturers? .....Well, you might like that because spec is okay too, right? Toyota will not participate in anything unless there is something in it for them, and I don't blame them. Chevy and Ford have to compete now. Chevy not so great at this apparently while Ford has stepped up. This has only become a problem because of recent success, and anti-Toyota bias. You will get over it. Ford is likely to win the Manufacturers Championship, and I wonder if Denny has the balls to go head to head with Harvick in Phoenix. I just love that OUR performance has improved. That TRD group is a sassy bunch

I'm not sure why other manufacturers don't run their program like Toyota does as it gives them more control and probably more bang for the buck. Toyota, Ford and GM need to do what they think is best for winning races and championships and I don't know specifics on why people are resentful of the way Toyota conducts itself.
 

HoopsMcCann

Jackman
New Member!
Joined
Jul 20, 2020
Messages
74
Points
18
Location
Southwest Michigan
None of us know how many cars HMS will run next year but anything other than 4 is a big step backward. I'm not saying this from a competition standpoint but from a sponsor standpoint as traditionally HMS has been quite good at putting sponsorship programs together for its teams. There is definitely a lot less money coming into the sport and while it may not have shown right away you can sure see it now.
 

LJ7201

Team Owner
Joined
Aug 31, 2017
Messages
465
Points
173
Location
Ohio
So what numbers would you like to see?
HMS, 10 cars.
JGR, 10 cars
Penske 10 cars
For a 30 car field times 30 races per year.??????
BTW the reason I don't mention SHR is they don't seem to be able to find sponsors for 4 cars never mind 8.
more like 5 or 6 each max, either way Penske has 3 as is and HMS apparently may downsize to 3 (doubt it bc I heard this last silly season)

I think if an owner wants to take the risk of opening a 5th team they should be able to. Maybe a limit of 5? I'm not sure. For my own entertainment value if you ask me if I'd rather a new JGR team join the field or a new back marker I'd prefer the former.
 

Hendrick4ever

Tire changer
Joined
Jul 18, 2020
Messages
97
Points
33
None of us know how many cars HMS will run next year but anything other than 4 is a big step backward. I'm not saying this from a competition standpoint but from a sponsor standpoint as traditionally HMS has been quite good at putting sponsorship programs together for its teams. There is definitely a lot less money coming into the sport and while it may not have shown right away you can sure see it now.
Agreed. As a huge Hendrick fan the idea of downsizing scares me. I’m nervous that Hendrick might be going in the same direction as Roush.
 

Charlie Spencer

Short tracks and road courses.
Joined
Oct 17, 2012
Messages
21,625
Points
883
Location
Lexington, SC
Why else would I want it renumbered? I keep telling Rick to quit calling me until he agrees, and he can put the big chicken back on the hood.
 

Kiante

Team Owner
Joined
Sep 6, 2013
Messages
15,841
Points
883
Location
Florida
Agreed. As a huge Hendrick fan the idea of downsizing scares me. I’m nervous that Hendrick might be going in the same direction as Roush.
Roush had to because they stretched themselves extremely thin at one point with five full-time cars.

They downsized because come Gen-6 car and post 2014 the team was a shell of its former self. Losing sponsorship left and right did not help either. 2015 had a Biffle, Bayne, and Stenhouse. We all know how that worked out.
 

Spotter22

Team Owner
Joined
Aug 17, 2017
Messages
5,444
Points
693
No surprise the 88 could be shuttered. Hell the owners are on board with no more qualifying or practice the rest of the year and I expect even next year. Sponsorship dollars will drop for everyone as well as salaries. You have to look outside the scope of NASCAR, this is a global situation.
 

StandOnIt

Farm Truck
Joined
Feb 26, 2013
Messages
44,503
Points
883
Location
yoooklahoma
Roush had to because they stretched themselves extremely thin at one point with five full-time cars.

They downsized because come Gen-6 car and post 2014 the team was a shell of its former self. Losing sponsorship left and right did not help either. 2015 had a Biffle, Bayne, and Stenhouse. We all know how that worked out.
Roush had Edwards, Kenseth and Biffle, but he doesn't pay well so he lost the two best drivers and hired Bayne and Stenhouse in their place. What that has to do with Hendrick doing the same thing is beyond me. I don't see anything similar except the rumor that Hendrick MAY BE shutting down the 88 car. But if Hendrick loses Byron and Bowman and hires Quinn Houff and Stenhouse :laugh: :flushed:
 

Kiante

Team Owner
Joined
Sep 6, 2013
Messages
15,841
Points
883
Location
Florida
Roush had Edwards, Kenseth and Biffle, but he doesn't pay well so he lost the two best drivers and hired Bayne and Stenhouse in their place. What that has to do with Hendrick doing the same thing is beyond me. I don't see anything similar except the rumor that Hendrick MAY BE shutting down the 88 car. But if Hendrick loses Byron and Bowman and hires Quinn Houff and Stenhouse :laugh: :flushed:
Stenhouse has honestly looked better than Buescher this season. Stenhouse has had some really fast cars, but JTG has been lacking reliability this season.

It's all hearsay, we'll see and I'm honestly waiting on Stern or Pockcrass to say something about the situation. I hope Bowman gets additional sponsorship and stays in the 88. I would like to see more support from Llumar and Cincinnati for the 88. Axalta and Valvoline can only do so many races. I think its interesting how oil primaries outside of Pennzoil only do so many races now in days for Cup teams.
 

StandOnIt

Farm Truck
Joined
Feb 26, 2013
Messages
44,503
Points
883
Location
yoooklahoma
Stenhouse has honestly looked better than Buescher this season. Stenhouse has had some really fast cars, but JTG has been lacking reliability this season.

It's all hearsay, we'll see and I'm honestly waiting on Stern or Pockcrass to say something about the situation. I hope Bowman gets additional sponsorship and stays in the 88. I would like to see more support from Llumar and Cincinnati for the 88. Axalta and Valvoline can only do so many races. I think its interesting how oil primaries outside of Pennzoil only do so many races now in days for Cup teams.
nope Stenhouse hasn't been better looked better or whatever than Beuscher.
 

Kiante

Team Owner
Joined
Sep 6, 2013
Messages
15,841
Points
883
Location
Florida
nope Stenhouse hasn't been better looked better or whatever than Beuscher.
He has to me. The past few races he's had top 10-15 speed in the 47. He's been good, but its been issue after issue for the 47 team and all to him not crashing. Kentucky was a bad run, but Kansas and Indy were reliability issues. Indy he got caught up in that pit lane snafu, but it is what it is for him. The whole organization has been off the mark the past month or so.

Unfortunately, Stenhouse and Preece have scored the least amount of points the last month. Together they have scored... 18 points.

Buescher I honestly expected more, but Roush is so hit or miss its not even funny.
 

StandOnIt

Farm Truck
Joined
Feb 26, 2013
Messages
44,503
Points
883
Location
yoooklahoma
Stenhouse last year driving a Roush mobile had one top 5 and 3 top 10''s.
Buescher this year 1 top 5 and 4 top tens and 7 races left.
 

Charlie Spencer

Short tracks and road courses.
Joined
Oct 17, 2012
Messages
21,625
Points
883
Location
Lexington, SC
As long as Stenhouse has that ridiculous haircut, he won't look better than ANYBODY.
My Darling Bride is convinced his car got sick Thursday night and puked him out. All I know is he didn't look like an idiot when he was hooked up with Danica. Well, at least not that kind of an idiot.
 

HoopsMcCann

Jackman
New Member!
Joined
Jul 20, 2020
Messages
74
Points
18
Location
Southwest Michigan
No surprise the 88 could be shuttered. Hell the owners are on board with no more qualifying or practice the rest of the year and I expect even next year. Sponsorship dollars will drop for everyone as well as salaries. You have to look outside the scope of NASCAR, this is a global situation.
I don't know what any team receives in total sponsorship dollars but I know I started hearing about the lack of those dollars around the time Sprint announced it was leaving. I think Sprint was paying around 75 million per year and that dropped to around 20 million when Monster took over and I don't know how much if anything Nascar is getting today from sponsors. Nascar and the tracks seem to be doing well but it is the teams that seem to be having to deal with the financial issues.
 

Kiante

Team Owner
Joined
Sep 6, 2013
Messages
15,841
Points
883
Location
Florida
Stenhouse last year driving a Roush mobile had one top 5 and 3 top 10''s.
Buescher this year 1 top 5 and 4 top tens and 7 races left.
Hence "Has to me" this season.

Just my opinion and what I've seen this season.
 

aunty dive

Team Owner
Contributor
Joined
Mar 17, 2014
Messages
22,901
Points
883
Nascar and the tracks seem to be doing well but it is the teams that seem to be having to deal with the financial issues.
Tracks generate a lot of revenue from people.

That’s a financial issue.
 

ahhculdee

Team Owner
Joined
Jul 10, 2017
Messages
229
Points
123
So what numbers would you like to see?
HMS, 10 cars.
JGR, 10 cars
Penske 10 cars
For a 30 car field times 30 races per year.??????
BTW the reason I don't mention SHR is they don't seem to be able to find sponsors for 4 cars never mind 8.
I mean let teams run as many as they want. Being back DNQs, makes the field more competitive. Rick Ware Racing is finding ways to circumvent the rules and run 20 junk cars anyway. Would much rather have more competitve cars. SHR would run 5 cars if they could (adding Larson and Briscoe). JGR would as well Bell and Jones.
 
Top Bottom