2021 Silly Season

wi_racefan said:
Would be cool to see the 4th car be a part time allstar car.

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Well, if you had the budget to do THAT, you would be better off to run one driver all year and run for the championship. It could be fun, but I don't know that it makes much sense financially.
 
StandOnIt said:
Here is a good one for this thread

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I posted last summer, when Nationwide Insurance announced their departure from the 88, that it wouldn't surprise me to see this happen... Bowman getting the Ally Financial sponsorship after Jimmie retires. I still hope it doesn't happen 'cause I'd hate to see the loss of another top-shelf car from the grid.
 
Makes sense with most of the #88’s inventory being filled by Chevy accessory partners. Never is good to see a quality seat disappear, but it would make sense in context and maybe a little contraction will be worthwhile for HMS. Besides Brad there isn’t really anyone of high caliber available and it sounds like he really wants an extension with Penske. They already are a very young team as well, so they may want to shy away from those types of drivers for now.

It would make the market tougher for someone like Bell or Jones depending on how JGR/LFR/TRD want to proceed.
 
I like the idea of closing the 88 and moving Bowman to the #48.
The 88 was created to make a home for the #8 Junior team.
 
I actually like this move versus adding yet another young guy. Also makes me wonder if they already know that Brad is off the table.

There's nobody in Xfinity worthy of that seat that's currently in a Chevy imo, and Erik Jones just feels like a weird fit to me.

I will say it's a bit concerning that Bowman still isn't able to secure his own sponsorship as a winning playoff driver.
 
StandOnIt said:
Toyota changed the model to franchising teams like a McDonnell's franchise. All about their mother ship factory TRD and the middleman Gibbs. They set Barney up with cars, drivers, pit crews. Did the same for Leavine. Both are quitting by what they say are rising "expenses". Ya can't have it both ways, the Hendricks, SHR Childress's Ganassi's are all independent businesses they can run any brand they want to run. None of the other OEM's went out and "set up" puppet race teams who are controlled by them, run who they want, even bench pit crews on their franchise teams when they don't let the mother ship team win a race except Toyota. So whenever one of them fails it is because they have the rug ripped out from under them. They gutted Barney and they are gutting Leavine. I'm sure you won't agree, but many of us see it that way.
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Yup, they sure changed the model from writing a check to actually participating in the sport. Gibbs took a hell of a risk on Toyota....and initially it wasn't a good one. Economics changed the way JGR and Toyota did business when TRD became the builder. They built this thing because nobody else wanted to be in a Toyota. Now, you cry because it worked. Why in the hell would Toyota run Leavine and Barney dry? How would that serve them? They helped, but then, as the NASCAR community would want it, it was up to them to get funding to continue their upward trend. You may not have noticed, but the economics have been pretty tough for a few years in this sport, and COVID is the final nail. Would you prefer that Toyota brand Leavine as "Toyota Racing" and fund it from start to finish?

You will never get over the Cowboy incident at Indy, but that's fine. Everybody has always known that these satellite teams are a fancy way of circumventing the four car rule.

Toyota showed this sport huge respect on entry, and it poured money into it when the economy went south. Can you image a series with just two manufacturers? .....Well, you might like that because spec is okay too, right? Toyota will not participate in anything unless there is something in it for them, and I don't blame them. Chevy and Ford have to compete now. Chevy not so great at this apparently while Ford has stepped up. This has only become a problem because of recent success, and anti-Toyota bias. You will get over it. Ford is likely to win the Manufacturers Championship, and I wonder if Denny has the balls to go head to head with Harvick in Phoenix. I just love that OUR performance has improved. That TRD group is a sassy bunch.
 
I really don't see that happening with how many free agents are out there. Smells like some BS.
 
ahhculdee said:
Also I really believe 4 car team rule should be lifted.
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So what numbers would you like to see?
HMS, 10 cars.
JGR, 10 cars
Penske 10 cars
For a 30 car field times 30 races per year.??????
BTW the reason I don't mention SHR is they don't seem to be able to find sponsors for 4 cars never mind 8.
 
Revman said:
Yup, they sure changed the model from writing a check to actually participating in the sport. Gibbs took a hell of a risk on Toyota....and initially it wasn't a good one. Economics changed the way JGR and Toyota did business when TRD became the builder. They built this thing because nobody else wanted to be in a Toyota. Now, you cry because it worked. Why in the hell would Toyota run Leavine and Barney dry? How would that serve them? They helped, but then, as the NASCAR community would want it, it was up to them to get funding to continue their upward trend. You may not have noticed, but the economics have been pretty tough for a few years in this sport, and COVID is the final nail. Would you prefer that Toyota brand Leavine as "Toyota Racing" and fund it from start to finish?

You will never get over the Cowboy incident at Indy, but that's fine. Everybody has always known that these satellite teams are a fancy way of circumventing the four car rule.

Toyota showed this sport huge respect on entry, and it poured money into it when the economy went south. Can you image a series with just two manufacturers? .....Well, you might like that because spec is okay too, right? Toyota will not participate in anything unless there is something in it for them, and I don't blame them. Chevy and Ford have to compete now. Chevy not so great at this apparently while Ford has stepped up. This has only become a problem because of recent success, and anti-Toyota bias. You will get over it. Ford is likely to win the Manufacturers Championship, and I wonder if Denny has the balls to go head to head with Harvick in Phoenix. I just love that OUR performance has improved. That TRD group is a sassy bunch

I'm not sure why other manufacturers don't run their program like Toyota does as it gives them more control and probably more bang for the buck. Toyota, Ford and GM need to do what they think is best for winning races and championships and I don't know specifics on why people are resentful of the way Toyota conducts itself.
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None of us know how many cars HMS will run next year but anything other than 4 is a big step backward. I'm not saying this from a competition standpoint but from a sponsor standpoint as traditionally HMS has been quite good at putting sponsorship programs together for its teams. There is definitely a lot less money coming into the sport and while it may not have shown right away you can sure see it now.
 
Team Penske said:
So what numbers would you like to see?
HMS, 10 cars.
JGR, 10 cars
Penske 10 cars
For a 30 car field times 30 races per year.??????
BTW the reason I don't mention SHR is they don't seem to be able to find sponsors for 4 cars never mind 8.
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more like 5 or 6 each max, either way Penske has 3 as is and HMS apparently may downsize to 3 (doubt it bc I heard this last silly season)

I think if an owner wants to take the risk of opening a 5th team they should be able to. Maybe a limit of 5? I'm not sure. For my own entertainment value if you ask me if I'd rather a new JGR team join the field or a new back marker I'd prefer the former.
 
HoopsMcCann said:
None of us know how many cars HMS will run next year but anything other than 4 is a big step backward. I'm not saying this from a competition standpoint but from a sponsor standpoint as traditionally HMS has been quite good at putting sponsorship programs together for its teams. There is definitely a lot less money coming into the sport and while it may not have shown right away you can sure see it now.
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Agreed. As a huge Hendrick fan the idea of downsizing scares me. I’m nervous that Hendrick might be going in the same direction as Roush.
 
Hendrick4ever said:
Agreed. As a huge Hendrick fan the idea of downsizing scares me. I’m nervous that Hendrick might be going in the same direction as Roush.
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Roush had to because they stretched themselves extremely thin at one point with five full-time cars.

They downsized because come Gen-6 car and post 2014 the team was a shell of its former self. Losing sponsorship left and right did not help either. 2015 had a Biffle, Bayne, and Stenhouse. We all know how that worked out.
 
No surprise the 88 could be shuttered. Hell the owners are on board with no more qualifying or practice the rest of the year and I expect even next year. Sponsorship dollars will drop for everyone as well as salaries. You have to look outside the scope of NASCAR, this is a global situation.
 
Kiante said:
Roush had to because they stretched themselves extremely thin at one point with five full-time cars.

They downsized because come Gen-6 car and post 2014 the team was a shell of its former self. Losing sponsorship left and right did not help either. 2015 had a Biffle, Bayne, and Stenhouse. We all know how that worked out.
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Roush had Edwards, Kenseth and Biffle, but he doesn't pay well so he lost the two best drivers and hired Bayne and Stenhouse in their place. What that has to do with Hendrick doing the same thing is beyond me. I don't see anything similar except the rumor that Hendrick MAY BE shutting down the 88 car. But if Hendrick loses Byron and Bowman and hires Quinn Houff and Stenhouse :laugh: :flushed:
 
StandOnIt said:
Roush had Edwards, Kenseth and Biffle, but he doesn't pay well so he lost the two best drivers and hired Bayne and Stenhouse in their place. What that has to do with Hendrick doing the same thing is beyond me. I don't see anything similar except the rumor that Hendrick MAY BE shutting down the 88 car. But if Hendrick loses Byron and Bowman and hires Quinn Houff and Stenhouse :laugh: :flushed:
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Stenhouse has honestly looked better than Buescher this season. Stenhouse has had some really fast cars, but JTG has been lacking reliability this season.

It's all hearsay, we'll see and I'm honestly waiting on Stern or Pockcrass to say something about the situation. I hope Bowman gets additional sponsorship and stays in the 88. I would like to see more support from Llumar and Cincinnati for the 88. Axalta and Valvoline can only do so many races. I think its interesting how oil primaries outside of Pennzoil only do so many races now in days for Cup teams.
 
Kiante said:
Stenhouse has honestly looked better than Buescher this season. Stenhouse has had some really fast cars, but JTG has been lacking reliability this season.

It's all hearsay, we'll see and I'm honestly waiting on Stern or Pockcrass to say something about the situation. I hope Bowman gets additional sponsorship and stays in the 88. I would like to see more support from Llumar and Cincinnati for the 88. Axalta and Valvoline can only do so many races. I think its interesting how oil primaries outside of Pennzoil only do so many races now in days for Cup teams.
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nope Stenhouse hasn't been better looked better or whatever than Beuscher.
 
StandOnIt said:
nope Stenhouse hasn't been better looked better or whatever than Beuscher.
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He has to me. The past few races he's had top 10-15 speed in the 47. He's been good, but its been issue after issue for the 47 team and all to him not crashing. Kentucky was a bad run, but Kansas and Indy were reliability issues. Indy he got caught up in that pit lane snafu, but it is what it is for him. The whole organization has been off the mark the past month or so.

Unfortunately, Stenhouse and Preece have scored the least amount of points the last month. Together they have scored... 18 points.

Buescher I honestly expected more, but Roush is so hit or miss its not even funny.
 
Stenhouse last year driving a Roush mobile had one top 5 and 3 top 10''s.
Buescher this year 1 top 5 and 4 top tens and 7 races left.
 
Formerjackman said:
As long as Stenhouse has that ridiculous haircut, he won't look better than ANYBODY.
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My Darling Bride is convinced his car got sick Thursday night and puked him out. All I know is he didn't look like an idiot when he was hooked up with Danica. Well, at least not that kind of an idiot.
 
Spotter22 said:
No surprise the 88 could be shuttered. Hell the owners are on board with no more qualifying or practice the rest of the year and I expect even next year. Sponsorship dollars will drop for everyone as well as salaries. You have to look outside the scope of NASCAR, this is a global situation.
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I don't know what any team receives in total sponsorship dollars but I know I started hearing about the lack of those dollars around the time Sprint announced it was leaving. I think Sprint was paying around 75 million per year and that dropped to around 20 million when Monster took over and I don't know how much if anything Nascar is getting today from sponsors. Nascar and the tracks seem to be doing well but it is the teams that seem to be having to deal with the financial issues.
 
HoopsMcCann said:
Nascar and the tracks seem to be doing well but it is the teams that seem to be having to deal with the financial issues.
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Tracks generate a lot of revenue from people.

That’s a financial issue.
 
Team Penske said:
So what numbers would you like to see?
HMS, 10 cars.
JGR, 10 cars
Penske 10 cars
For a 30 car field times 30 races per year.??????
BTW the reason I don't mention SHR is they don't seem to be able to find sponsors for 4 cars never mind 8.
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I mean let teams run as many as they want. Being back DNQs, makes the field more competitive. Rick Ware Racing is finding ways to circumvent the rules and run 20 junk cars anyway. Would much rather have more competitve cars. SHR would run 5 cars if they could (adding Larson and Briscoe). JGR would as well Bell and Jones.
 
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