'21 Generation 7 Car news

Personally I don't think anybody is keen on joining Nascar. It took the yotas like 8 years to be any good at it. Toughest competition in the world.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Just me but that’s a bigger change to the on-track performance than the number of wheel nuts. Man, oh man…
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If I had to guess, no tape is about keeping the motors cooler. They increased the number of uses for both short and long blocks this year. Big money saver. They probably are figuring on stretching that even more with the Next Gen
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Just me but that’s a bigger change to the on-track performance than the number of wheel nuts. Man, oh man…
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Looks like NASCAR doesn’t want teams adding extra downforce to the car at all and they want the engine temperature consistently maintained. The more tape is added, the hotter the temperature under the hood and it sucks all the air out, adding downforce.

I predict a lot of “bump the car infront of you to shrink the size of the air vent” occurrences.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
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Whoa, but hood louvers will disipate all the heat now.

I can imagine engineers and crew chiefs wanting to close those hood louvers up during qualifying runs. Maybe a bit of open and close action of them during races for an extra bit of straight-line speed?
 
cars are going to be I think it's either two or three inches higher next year also to let the air run under the car.
 
StandOnIt said:
I bet somebody tries it
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Chad Knaus looking at those louvers:
200w.webp
 
ChexOrWrex said:
The more tape is added, the hotter the temperature under the hood and it sucks all the air out, adding downforce.
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Okay, that’s a new one on me. Would you explain in more detail? I thought tape worked only by making the opening smaller so more air flowed over the car. If the temp increase sucks air out, what’s doing the sucking, where’s it pulled from, and where does it go?
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Okay, that’s a new one on me. Would you explain in more detail? I thought tape worked only by making the opening smaller so more air flowed over the car. If the temp increase sucks air out, what’s doing the sucking, where’s it pulled from, and where does it go?
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That's the big payout is aero, but cutting the air from getting thru the radiator can burn up the motor.
 
Somebody is going to tamper with the height limiting pieces. Might pull a Stewie Haas and make their own with numbers and all.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Okay, that’s a new one on me. Would you explain in more detail? I thought tape worked only by making the opening smaller so more air flowed over the car. If the temp increase sucks air out, what’s doing the sucking, where’s it pulled from, and where does it go?
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The hotter the temperature, the higher the pressure under the hood. The high pressure removes air under the hood and creates more downforce. Essentially, the hotter the engine, the higher the front downforce. Theres a balance between maximum downforce and keeping the engine cool enough to operate efficiently.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
The hotter the temperature, the higher the pressure under the hood. The high pressure removes air under the hood and creates more downforce. Essentially, the hotter the engine, the higher the front downforce. Theres a balance between maximum downforce and keeping the engine cool enough to operate efficiently.
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If you say so, Larry Mac.

I'll take your word for it. I'd try harder to understand how high pressure removes air but since it's all about to be moot anyway, I won't bother you further.
 
StandOnIt said:
So after hours weeks and months of test and retest, nailing down suppliers and cutting costs, it's time to develop an entirely new motor and spend no telling how much money doing it.
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Nope. Use existing OEM technology. Put a better set of rods in it, some good valve springs and short pushrods and let er rip.
 
Kiante said:
Whoa, but hood louvers will disipate all the heat now.

I can imagine engineers and crew chiefs wanting to close those hood louvers up during qualifying runs. Maybe a bit of open and close action of them during races for an extra bit of straight-line speed?
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Nobody is going to close the hood louvers. The reason they exist is because the next gen car has a totally flat underbody. Panels cover the entire undercarriage, which means that hot air can't exit under the engine bay and out the bottom of the car anymore. The vents in the hood are to let that hot air exit from the top. If you seal those up the heatsoak would be insane and you'd lose HP quickly.
 
StandOnIt said:
So after hours weeks and months of test and retest, nailing down suppliers and cutting costs, it's time to develop an entirely new motor and spend no telling how much money doing it.
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What do you wanna do, keep using outdated port injection pushrod engines for eternity? These engines are dinosaurs.
 
StandOnIt said:
So after hours weeks and months of test and retest, nailing down suppliers and cutting costs, it's time to develop an entirely new motor and spend no telling how much money doing it.
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The quote "I can't afford for you to save me anymore money" comes to mind.

So I have to throw out my whole fleet of cars and buy new ones and now I have to spend money on new engine development?

That's almost as good as we spent all this time and money developing a new and better car, but yeah we should run the old car on the dirt at Bristol. So you're telling we developed a car that shouldn't even be run on all the events on the schedule?

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cheesepuffs said:
Nobody is going to close the hood louvers. The reason they exist is because the next gen car has a totally flat underbody. Panels cover the entire undercarriage, which means that hot air can't exit under the engine bay and out the bottom of the car anymore. The vents in the hood are to let that hot air exit from the top. If you seal those up the heatsoak would be insane and you'd lose HP quickly.
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Makes sense.

I love this discussion.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
If you say so, Larry Mac.

I'll take your word for it. I'd try harder to understand how high pressure removes air but since it's all about to be moot anyway, I won't bother you further.
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Air density changes to it’s surrounding pressure and temperature.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
The hotter the temperature, the higher the pressure under the hood. The high pressure removes air under the hood and creates more downforce. Essentially, the hotter the engine, the higher the front downforce. Theres a balance between maximum downforce and keeping the engine cool enough to operate efficiently.
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Heated air flowing through the radiator exits the Gen 6 through the bottom of the engine compartment and through the hood louvers on the new cars.

High pressure air exerts downforce when it acts against a surface backed by air at lower pressure. That's not the case in your example.
 
I’d be shocked if NASCAR ever left the V8 game to be honest. F1 runs only about 190 miles a weekend, Indy runs 500 miles only in one event and typically is around 200 miles for road courses. To run 36 weeks a year and routinely hit 400-500 miles a weekend is a big ask for an engine
 
aunty dive said:
Heated air flowing through the radiator exits the Gen 6 through the bottom of the engine compartment and through the hood louvers on the new cars.

High pressure air exerts downforce when it acts against a surface backed by air at lower pressure. That's not the case in your example.
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I tried to put it in layman’s terms, I wasnt sure the technical specifics would be understood either.
 
Mispeedway15 said:
I’d be shocked if NASCAR ever left the V8 game to be honest. F1 runs only about 190 miles a weekend, Indy runs 500 miles only in one event and typically is around 200 miles for road courses. To run 36 weeks a year and routinely hit 400-500 miles a weekend is a big ask for an engine
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Is it? I think as long as you can manage RPM's and heat any motor can run a long time.

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Mispeedway15 said:
I’d be shocked if NASCAR ever left the V8 game to be honest. F1 runs only about 190 miles a weekend, Indy runs 500 miles only in one event and typically is around 200 miles for road courses. To run 36 weeks a year and routinely hit 400-500 miles a weekend is a big ask for an engine
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It's actually easier to make a smaller engine last, as long as it's tuned correctly. Bigger engines have bigger parts. All that rotating weight with each turn of the crankshaft is a lot of force. Bigger pistons strain the connecting rods more than smaller pistons do for example. With a smaller engine you have lighter/smaller parts that are less prone to failure from stress and fatigue.
 
DanicaFreak said:
maybe the new car will entice new manufactures ?

dodge?
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Dodge is gone, people need to start accepting that. If they wanted to come back they would have by now considering they still have a current-gen engine they could have been using this whole time.

I think the most likely new manufacturer will be Kia. They're pushing hard to become a bigger player in the US market and NASCAR would ingrain them in the American landscape more.

Honda has IndyCar and IMSA already, Nissan isn't doing so hot and doesn't really put money into motorsports anymore, Mazda is too tiny of a company although I would love to see it happen, Subaru would have to be allowed a boxer engine, VW is going all electric, and none of the other Euro brands fit in terms of marketing.
 
See, this is what happens when I have to actually work all day (still working), I miss so much ****.

ChexOrWrex said:
Next Gen car looking great in iRacing

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Okay, that made me laugh.

cheesepuffs said:
Ty Majeski would have 7 Cup championships by now if thats how it really worked. Keep in mind that Dale Jr now works for iRacing. He's on the payroll, he's going to talk it up.

The tire model up until fairly recently had the most grip when dead cold to start a run, no heat, then fell off immediately as it got temperature. Dirty air and drafting in iRacing are the exact same because they haven't been able to figure out how to model dirty air yet. There's no cushion effect when running the high line against the wall either because that also hasn't been figured out. There's glitches in setups sometimes where the most camber you run the faster you go, even if it's a cartoonish amount of camber that is nothing close to realistic. It's a good video game game but people need to to acting like it's reality.
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Nitro Dude said:
That will really suck for a lot of very good hard working employees with families to feed that may still have been recovering financially from the time off due to the pandemic. The driver haulers is one job that it shouldn't affect though. They will still need to get the cars to the track on schedule .
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Yea, there's going to be a reduction in shop staff for sure, which is sad. I don't know if these guys can just go join another racing series because I think all motorsport series are heading in the direction that IndyCar and NASCAR are heading. Maybe F1, but I think they're unveiling some changes coming in 2022 as well, so we'll see.

StandOnIt said:
Personally I don't think anybody is keen on joining Nascar. It took the yotas like 8 years to be any good at it. Toughest competition in the world.
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And the most grueling schedule in the motorsport world.

Now to address @cheesepuffs statement. I think your information is a little dated, iRacing now simulates the air bubble these cars get from running up against the wall and they even improved the draft model on the superspeedway so there's air bubble in between two cars which will affect the rear downforce of the lead car and the front downforce of the follow car. Tires is something that has been iRacing weak point, but they are improving with each build, hotfox, and patch.

With each new piece of content and with each major upgrade (tires, aero, setups, etc.) iRacing isn't going to get it 100% right on the initial release. However, what makes iRacing better than Forza, Assetto Corsa, or rFactor is that you do get the hotfixes, you do get the patch that comes out as soon as it's ready. iRacing has four major builds that come out roughly every three months, and then in between those big builds, you have the little fixes that they distribute throughout the week as needed. iRacing also has retired and current drivers from different series doing Q&A and beta testing to make sure that they get it as close as possible.

So yea, the current iRacing NextGen model isn't 100% going to be accurate to the real world, but one of the strong suit of the program is that it will get better sooner than you realize, and it will become more and more like it's real life counterpart. When you have a program that simulates everything from track wear, to the weather, to the cars themselves, there's going to be slip up here and there.
 
cheesepuffs said:
@SpeedPagan I've been iRacing for a handful of years now, I know about the major builds and updates. Didn't know about the air being fixed, that's good news. I still maintain that the sport and the broadcast booths have oversold it.
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For a brief time last year, it's all they had to sell. That's a big reason for the pretending. Everyone was desperate for an escape.

I think you're spot on. It's an impressive achievement, and a great tool for hobbyists and real racers to learn when logging actual practice laps isn't practical or possible.

As competition or spectator entertainment, it is a pale imitation. There are hundreds if not thousands of iRacing subscribers who are better on that platform than all but the few NASCAR drivers who are also iRacing veterans. It's an entirely different thing, and I think that should be embraced. Simulating what isn't possible in the real world is more interesting to me than a slavish devotion to realism that will never be real.
 
gnomesayin said:
For a brief time last year, it's all they had to sell. That's a big reason for the pretending. Everyone was desperate for an escape.

I think you're spot on. It's an impressive achievement, and a great tool for hobbyists and real racers to learn when logging actual practice laps isn't practical or possible.

As competition or spectator entertainment, it is a pale imitation. There are hundreds if not thousands of iRacing subscribers who are better on that platform than all but the few NASCAR drivers who are also iRacing veterans. It's an entirely different thing, and I think that should be embraced. Simulating what isn't possible in the real world is more interesting to me than a slavish devotion to realism that will never be real.
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Spot on.

For reference, iRacing has so much grip coded into the next gen car that it can run WFO at any 1.5 indefinitely. There is no fall off. Also, it can clock 12 second laps at Bristol, nearly WFO there too. It’s silly. In no way is that iRacing car representative of how the actual car handles.
 
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