Cup RACE thread --- Martinsville

I just wanna say congrats to posters here like @AdoubleU24, @DewChaser988, @Dr_B_UNC and @beantownkid10. Apologies if I missed one but I think these are the biggest Elliott fans on the board. I pull for the young guys like Elliott, Blaney, Jones, Wallace, etc.. but that same passion like I had with Gordon doesn’t exist.

I got to see Gordon win his in 2001 and it’s not often that you get to see favorite team compete for the championship. Live it up, enjoy it. Cheers!
 
klemmabyna said:
not many of us old timers left anymore. the chase is one big reason why in my opinion. maybe the current television contract makes it worth it to nascar. but I don't believe this way of determining a champion even increases interest from those that have never watched the sport. only makes it seem more contrived. JMO
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I keep saying this.. but I believe the old format was outdated. There was a reason the average nascar fan was aged 60. Nascar lost popularity because it's market increased beyond it's original demographic, which was an older population that wasn't getting any younger, and a population that was attached to what nascar represented to them.

I may get crap for this, but nascar removing the year long system WAS the right call. I hope we never see that again. Nascar expanded it's brand, and the system was outdated. Today's short attention spanned world will have no interest in a season long format. NASCAR NEEDS some sort of post season, but they can't have a system with such lottery results like this.

I know everyone hated the Johnson era, but that particular format and era got a lot of coverage outside NASCAR media. People hated NASCARs coverage on ESPN, but the fact that espn aired races was good for the sport.

The original two or three Chase formats were great. And I'd love to see them bring that back, along with stage points.

I will never say a driver got screwed by a system. The rules to win a championship are what they are. Jeff Gordon was never screwed, Carl Edwards at Roush was never screwed. However, given Harvick's season, I will say that it feels wrong that he missed it, even though everything else he did this year doesn't matter, and hasn't mattered for almost 20 years.

I propose going back to the original Chase system.

10 race shoot out. The top 10 in points make the playoffs. Everyone is separated by 5 points, with an additional 5 points for wins. Regular season champion gains 10 extra points for winning the title.

Points per race are scored as they are today. Stages are scored, but no yellow is thrown.

Also, 2 points for leading a lap.

And bring back the 5 extra points for leading the most laps.

10 race shootout consistency matters. Winning matters. Regular season champ will likely have an advantage unless someone goes on a tear like Stewart in 2011.


Anyways, I'd bet a lot of money that in 2022, with the gen 7 car, we get a new format.

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CodeMan125 said:
Feel better man !
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Thanks I don’t want to hijack the thread ha ha. I told everyone in the podium two days ago but here goes: My wife got diagnosed first and now I’m sick. We’re okay she lost her taste and smell but no fever and a bit difficult breathing but for the most part she’s hanging in there. I’m about the same no fever yet but extremely tired, no appetite, and some discomfort in my chest but breathing is fine. It’s the lack of energy killing me I fell asleep at 1230 and woke up after Chase took the checkers. But yea we’re about as good as can be while battling this. Appreciate everyone’s concern, I didn’t want to say anything but I’ve been crabby about missing the race amongst being sick and it came out over these waves.
 
Snappy D said:
Who says you wont? Formula 1 runs a full season points system and is still pretty popular all over the world
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Because this is America. Nascar can't pander to the older demographic.

Kids these days don't want watch a sport knowing who wins the championship weeks before the season ends.

Some playoff system is the right call. This one we have now isn't. The american sports fan is who nascar is targeting, and people who aren't die hard race fans are hard wired for some sort of post season.

The original Chase gave us this, while also rewarding consistency.

I vote for a modified Chase. Stage points are still scored. Drivers are scored 5 points apart based on their regular season finishing order. 5 point bonuses for number of wins, and regular season champion gains an additional 10 points. This way, we still get the rush of a Chase, but the regular season Champion still has an advantage, and would be tough to beat unless we get a 2011 run from a driver.

Nascar needs to find the right balance between post season and regular season balance. Both are needed now. Strictly playoffs don't work. Season long format is extinct, which it should be.
We need something new.

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I’m not celebrating until tech is done, but even I know NASCAR isn’t THAT stupid.
 
jaqua19 said:
Because this is America. Nascar can't pander to the older demographic.

Kids these days don't want watch a sport knowing who wins the championship weeks before the season ends.

Some playoff system is the right call. This one we have now isn't. The american sports fan is who nascar is targeting, and people who aren't die hard race fans are hard wired for some sort of post season.

The original Chase gave us this, while also rewarding consistency.

I vote for a modified Chase. Stage points are still scored. Drivers are scored 5 points apart based on their regular season finishing order. 5 point bonuses for number of wins, and regular season champion gains an additional 10 points. This way, we still get the rush of a Chase, but the regular season Champion still has an advantage, and would be tough to beat unless we get a 2011 run from a driver.

Nascar needs to find the right balance between post season and regular season balance. Both are needed now. Strictly playoffs don't work. Season long format is extinct, which it should be.
We need something new.

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Well first off I never said anything about an older demographic or older fans. I think that has nothing to do with my original post. Plus I’m not an old timer, I’m 35. Yea F1 is the most popular form of Motorsport sport in the world so you lost me there “this is America” there is zero talk with Lewis Hamilton again dominating another season in regards to changing a points system because people need to be entertained. I would venture there are a whole hell a lot of people entertained watching Lewis and his historic run. The pandering to “fans” to make things exciting for them is what you get with Harvicks magnificent season gone to waste, the thing is the racing has always been exciting. Thats why most of us tune in...to see racing. Indy Car is also damn exciting, their season came down to the last race and they don’t use a playoffs system.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
I just wanna say congrats to posters here like @AdoubleU24, @DewChaser988, @Dr_B_UNC and @beantownkid10. Apologies if I missed one but I think these are the biggest Elliott fans on the board. I pull for the young guys like Elliott, Blaney, Jones, Wallace, etc.. but that same passion like I had with Gordon doesn’t exist.

I got to see Gordon win his in 2001 and it’s not often that you get to see favorite team compete for the championship. Live it up, enjoy it. Cheers!
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Thanks.

You can imagine how frustrating it is for your favorite drivers breakthrough moment to be overshadowed by a bunch of fans complaining about the system in place. It's especially frustrating coming for an old school Jeff Gordon fan when the majority of the fanbase was happy he didn't win the 2 other championships he would have won if not for a Chase because back then you were either a Jeff Gordon fan or you hated JG. No in between. So to hear the complaints and the talk overshadow what Chase Elliott accomplished tonight is bittersweet to say the least.
 
NASCAR Apologist said:
Right on the first part, at least half the fans would leave if you got rid of playoffs. Not enough drama.
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Of course that totally ignores the 2/3rds of the fans that left, in part because of it. All we have done since 2003 is a feeble attempt to replace what we already had. Do any of the millions of Formula One fans around the world care that most years F1 has been Lewis Hamilton's personal playground, or Michael Schumacher's before that?
 
beantownkid10 said:
Thanks.

You can imagine how frustrating it is for your favorite drivers breakthrough moment to be overshadowed by a bunch of fans complaining about the system in place. It's especially frustrating coming for an old school Jeff Gordon fan when the majority of the fanbase was happy he didn't win the 2 other championships he would have won if not for a Chase because back then you were either a Jeff Gordon fan or you hated JG. No in between. So to hear the complaints and the talk overshadow what Chase Elliott accomplished tonight is bittersweet to say the least.
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“Atleast they are making noise”
 
ChexOrWrex said:
I just wanna say congrats to posters here like @AdoubleU24, @DewChaser988, @Dr_B_UNC and @beantownkid10. Apologies if I missed one but I think these are the biggest Elliott fans on the board. I pull for the young guys like Elliott, Blaney, Jones, Wallace, etc.. but that same passion like I had with Gordon doesn’t exist.

I got to see Gordon win his in 2001 and it’s not often that you get to see favorite team compete for the championship. Live it up, enjoy it. Cheers!
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Well said Chex.

This is something most fans don't get to enjoy often. I grew up a Ricky Rudd fan in the 90s, and into the 2000s. Made the shift to Carl Edwards mid 2005. My first 7 or so years as a nascar fan, I just wanted to see Ricky win. I didn't know what it was like to be a fan of a driver capable of winning a Championship.

Finally experienced that as a Carl Edwards fan. 3 particular seasons it felt like it could have been "my year" as a fan. 2008 wasn't bad. I hated Jimmie, but I was only 17, and was excited about Carl's career being so young, and all the wins he had that year.

2011 was absolutely nauseating. Worst I've ever felt as a NASCAR fan. My best friend was a Stewart fan so that was really, really uncomfortable at the time. 2016 would have been bad, but Jimmie saved the season for me. As a Rudd fan and an Edwards fan, I never got to experience the high of watching my driver win a title. Only the hope and disappointment of watching him lose it.

When you feel it's your year, man life is good, so congrats to those guys. Watching your guy go on and seal the deal? Well...not many fans know what that's like, and it is a privilege. Today is a big day for Elliot fans. Feel bad if it feels tainted because of the Harvick situation.

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Snappy D said:
Thanks I don’t want to hijack the thread ha ha. I told everyone in the podium two days ago but here goes: My wife got diagnosed first and now I’m sick. We’re okay she lost her taste and smell but no fever and a bit difficult breathing but for the most part she’s hanging in there. I’m about the same no fever yet but extremely tired, no appetite, and some discomfort in my chest but breathing is fine. It’s the lack of energy killing me I fell asleep at 1230 and woke up after Chase took the checkers. But yea we’re about as good as can be while battling this. Appreciate everyone’s concern, I didn’t want to say anything but I’ve been crabby about missing the race amongst being sick and it came out over these waves.
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Feel better dude. Sorry to hear this.

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Snappy D said:
Well first off I never said anything about an older demographic or older fans. I think that has nothing to do with my original post. Plus I’m not an old timer, I’m 35. Yea F1 is the most popular form of Motorsport sport in the world so you lost me there “this is America” there is zero talk with Lewis Hamilton again dominating another season in regards to changing a points system because people need to be entertained. I would venture there are a whole hell a lot of people entertained watching Lewis and his historic run. The pandering to “fans” to make things exciting for them is what you get with Harvicks magnificent season gone to waste, the thing is the racing has always been exciting. Thats why most of us tune in...to see racing. Indy Car is also damn exciting, their season came down to the last race and they don’t use a playoffs system.
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Are there though? Nascar is an american sport. You think anyone outside of the autoracing community even knows who Hamilton is?

My point is that nascar clearly isn't pandering to the autoracing community at this point.

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Dr_B_UNC said:
I’m not celebrating until tech is done, but even I know NASCAR isn’t THAT stupid.
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It looks like he's clear, but I kind of wondered if maybe they WOULD be, in order to get Harvick back in next week.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
I just wanna say congrats to posters here like @AdoubleU24, @DewChaser988, @Dr_B_UNC and @beantownkid10. Apologies if I missed one but I think these are the biggest Elliott fans on the board. I pull for the young guys like Elliott, Blaney, Jones, Wallace, etc.. but that same passion like I had with Gordon doesn’t exist.

I got to see Gordon win his in 2001 and it’s not often that you get to see favorite team compete for the championship. Live it up, enjoy it. Cheers!
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It’s been fun. I prefer the old system, but this is what we have and you play the cards you’re dealt. I was done with NASCAR when Jeff Burton retired. (Loves driver because I saw him come up through late models locally) after being a Bill Elliott fan before. Chase came on scene and I latched on. I 100% understand criticisms and “haters,” because I did that same to Dale Jr. But, nepotism or not, he has won a Nationwide series title as a rookie, then after struggling against expectations, established himself as a legit title contender. He’s won at all types of track: superspeedway, intermediate, short track, and became the road course king. I haven’t had this much fun and excitement since his dad going for the title in 1992. I’ve been passionate, and frankly I’ve been an annoying ahole at times with my fandom on this board. I apologize. But I am soaking this up!
 
Word on twitter is there is an investigation going on with Jones being told not to pass the 11 car.
 
Also amongst all the points system bitching , congrats to all you hardcore Elliott fans on here. It’s awesome to see your favorite driver win, but like Chex said...for me it hasn’t been the same since JG retired and 95,97,98,01 were pretty awesome. 14 and 15 were pretty sweet too. Enjoy this moment, it’s so awesome to see your favorite driver and team win championships, makes all the angst worth it. My JG fandom has been divided up between Chase, Harvick, Byron, Bowman, Dillon, Jones and Reddick. But there’s NOTHING like cheering for YOUR guy...makes me miss JG even more.
 
Dr_B_UNC said:
@Snappy D hang in there, man. Thoughts and prayers your way. This pandemic is no joke!
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Thank you. Thus far we’ve been lucky and my wife is slowly getting better. She was getting worse each day since last Sunday but looks to be turning the corner. Now it’s my turn I guess but like I said from what I’ve read and talking to people that have had it we could have been walloped worse than we’ve been. Thanks again!
 
jaqua19 said:
Are there though? Nascar is an american sport. You think anyone outside of the autoracing community even knows who Hamilton is?

My point is that nascar clearly isn't pandering to the autoracing community at this point.

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Well our auto racing community or whole? Because if you’re a racing fan I would think you would know who Lewis Hamilton is, thought I read behind Ronaldo and Messi he had the most endorsement money in 19. That’s a shame if you’re even watching racing and don’t know who he is, missing out. Plus I would hope they have an idea who he his by him being at JG’s last race 5 years ago and being in his pit. But that’s not your point, your point is the points system. And since we will never get the old cup system back, I’ll meet you halfway....Chase For The Cup. Top 12 drivers, maybe a win and you’re in?
 
Formerjackman said:
Of course that totally ignores the 2/3rds of the fans that left, in part because of it. All we have done since 2003 is a feeble attempt to replace what we already had. Do any of the millions of Formula One fans around the world care that most years F1 has been Lewis Hamilton's personal playground, or Michael Schumacher's before that?
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If anyone left because of it more have joined because of it. I doubt anyone really left because of it anyways.

Formula Un fans probably want closer championships too.
 
jaqua19 said:
I keep saying this.. but I believe the old format was outdated. There was a reason the average nascar fan was aged 60. Nascar lost popularity because it's market increased beyond it's original demographic, which was an older population that wasn't getting any younger, and a population that was attached to what nascar represented to them.

I may get crap for this, but nascar removing the year long system WAS the right call. I hope we never see that again. Nascar expanded it's brand, and the system was outdated. Today's short attention spanned world will have no interest in a season long format. NASCAR NEEDS some sort of post season, but they can't have a system with such lottery results like this.

I know everyone hated the Johnson era, but that particular format and era got a lot of coverage outside NASCAR media. People hated NASCARs coverage on ESPN, but the fact that espn aired races was good for the sport.

The original two or three Chase formats were great. And I'd love to see them bring that back, along with stage points.

I will never say a driver got screwed by a system. The rules to win a championship are what they are. Jeff Gordon was never screwed, Carl Edwards at Roush was never screwed. However, given Harvick's season, I will say that it feels wrong that he missed it, even though everything else he did this year doesn't matter, and hasn't mattered for almost 20 years.

I propose going back to the original Chase system.

10 race shoot out. The top 10 in points make the playoffs. Everyone is separated by 5 points, with an additional 5 points for wins. Regular season champion gains 10 extra points for winning the title.

Points per race are scored as they are today. Stages are scored, but no yellow is thrown.

Also, 2 points for leading a lap.

And bring back the 5 extra points for leading the most laps.

10 race shootout consistency matters. Winning matters. Regular season champ will likely have an advantage unless someone goes on a tear like Stewart in 2011.


Anyways, I'd bet a lot of money that in 2022, with the gen 7 car, we get a new format.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
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THIS
 
Mike Crayne said:
Word on twitter is there is an investigation going on with Jones being told not to pass the 11 car.
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That's what this format has spawned. Don't pass this one, block this one, slow this one down, win and you are in..points points points and it really rewards the larger multi car teams who can play that game. I guess some will call it racing. What happened couldn't have split this rediculous format apart better than to have a team who had won 9 races, were way ahead on regular points, but aren't in the final race.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
I just wanna say congrats to posters here like @AdoubleU24, @DewChaser988, @Dr_B_UNC and @beantownkid10. Apologies if I missed one but I think these are the biggest Elliott fans on the board. I pull for the young guys like Elliott, Blaney, Jones, Wallace, etc.. but that same passion like I had with Gordon doesn’t exist.

I got to see Gordon win his in 2001 and it’s not often that you get to see favorite team compete for the championship. Live it up, enjoy it. Cheers!
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Ayyye, thanks brother! I gotta say, I didn't think I'd have the same passion once Gordon left either, but it didn't take long for it to come right back with Chase.

I'll shout out @2 Sweet, I know he's an old Gordon turned Chase guy as well.

And @Johali, he was smiling down watching this one today. Wish he could be here to post about it.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
So completely unreliable.
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Twitter, the sewage system of the internet.
Snappy D said:
Thank you. Thus far we’ve been lucky and my wife is slowly getting better. She was getting worse each day since last Sunday but looks to be turning the corner. Now it’s my turn I guess but like I said from what I’ve read and talking to people that have had it we could have been walloped worse than we’ve been. Thanks again!
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Get better, man!
 
last call here: once upon a time the sport became popular because of the racing, not who or how a champion was determined. the general public only drew interest when the legitimate multi-time champion was suddenly challenged by a relative newcomer.

I still watch races for the racing. but the hands off approach by non-championship racers and team/manufacturer dynamics during a chase scenario makes the end of the season far less entertaining to me.

I will still pay attention. but my racing entertainment dollars will be spent local short tracks
 
NASCAR Apologist said:
If anyone left because of it more have joined because of it. I doubt anyone really left because of it anyways.
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REALLY? Is THAT why the the live attendence is 30-40% of what it was and TV ratings are the lowest they have been in two decades? Exactly where ARE all these "new" fans at, because I sure as hell can't find them. I don't think I even personally KNOW a single person who has become a NASCAR fan since 2003. The ONLY NASCAR fans I know are a handful of diehards like myself that haven't given it up yet. There was a time at work where SEVERAL of us would get yelled at for talking NASCAR instead of working. When Chase won his first race at Watkins Glen a few years ago, I wore my Elliott shirt to work, and only two people even knew who he WAS. Our most popular driver........ All the under 40 guys I work with can't even name an active driver. AND, when I ask people who were rabid fans and now aren't why, the NUMBER ONE answer is, "I just got sick of all the changes and the goofy chase".
 
AdoubleU24 said:
And @Johali, he was smiling down watching this one today. Wish he could be here to post about it.
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Oh goddamit man that got me
tenor.gif
 
Formerjackman said:
REALLY? Is THAT why the the live attendence is 30-40% of what it was and TV ratings are the lowest they have been in two decades? Exactly where ARE all these "new" fans at, because I sure as hell can't find them. I don't think I even personally KNOW a single person who has become a NASCAR fan since 2003. The ONLY NASCAR fans I know are a handful of diehards like myself that haven't given it up yet. There was a time at work where SEVERAL of us would get yelled at for talking NASCAR instead of working. When Chase won his first race at Watkins Glen a few years ago, I wore my Elliott shirt to work, and only two people even knew who he WAS. Our most popular driver........ All the under 40 guys I work with can't even name an active driver. AND, when I ask people who were rabid fans and now aren't why, the NUMBER ONE answer is, "I just got sick of all the changes and the goofy chase".
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There you have it folks, he wore a Tshirt to work and nobody knew who Chase was. Fold the tents
 
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